3rd World Memorandum

[Jack Langner]

It has come to my attention whilst browsing through the final comments section of the survey that the outsourcing to 3rd world countries is quite an issue with a lot of you. I feel that those of us who harbor these sort of negative feelings are maybe not considering all the facts. (before I continue – I agree that software piracy is a problem that threatens us all.)

I myself am a third world citizen, and although I could carry on and on about how an average 3d software package costs about 20 times our average monthly wage and how tertiary education is a privilege where I live, I will take it for granted that this has been said by others already – and noted. There is another much more important point that I believe is being overlooked by people who form an opinion about this topic.

It is remarkable for me to see how many first world professionals (especially from the US) have a problem with outsourcing to 3rd world countries. Remarkable because of the fact that most of my software/hardware, is purchased from 1st world countries (especially the US). It astounds me that people mean to suggest that its OK for me too wake up, drink my Nescafe, shave with my Gillette, put on my Nike’s, get in my Ford, light a Stuyvesant with my Zippo on the way whilst listening to my Panasonic car radio, have a MacDonalds breakfast, check my calls on my Nokia, sit at my desk in front of my Mecer/HP/AMD/LG/Samsung machine running my MICROSOFT/Discreet/Autodesk/Adobe software as long as I don’t endeavor to use any of these items to obtain work from a first world country. This is truly astounding. You only have to go to the homepage of this website to see the results of 1st world marketing.

3rd world countries support 1st world countries to a much larger extent than visa versa. 3rd world countries did not start globalization, 1st world countries did. They did it for reasons they deemed to be beneficial to themselves. Now that the 3rd world countries also want to benefit from this, it seems as though some of them mean to close the door on us. These type of double standards could be could be given a name. Some might call it exploitation. I won’t. But some might.

We all have things that make our lives more challenging. Some have more and harder challenges than others. To some losing a project might mean that they have to buy a smaller second car, to some, loosing a project might mean that they have to look for another place to stay.

We are all fortunate that we work in an industry where your quality is your final product. It can be seen directly in the work you do.

Rather focus on yourself and push yourself to be as good as you possibly can and applaud the success of your piers, for their success is your challenge that would lead to your growth. Herein lays true fulfillment.

We are all adversaries … not enemies.
Sincerely
ArchMage – South Africa

[Ernest Burden III]

I myself am a third world citizen...It astounds me that people mean to suggest that its OK for me too wake up, drink my Nescafe, shave with my Gillette, put on my Nike’s, get in my Ford, light a Stuyvesant with my Zippo on the way whilst listening to my Panasonic car radio, have a MacDonalds breakfast, check my calls on my Nokia, sit at my desk in front of my Mecer/HP/AMD/LG/Samsung machine running my MICROSOFT/Discreet/Autodesk/Adobe software as long as I don’t endeavor to use any of these items to obtain work from a first world country. – South Africa

A truely profound observation. Thank you for saying it.

I look at 'outsourcing' as expoitation, but if I were to pay the provider what I would pay someone in the US then I am not expoiting them. The next hurdle is nationalistic protectionism. I feel some of it, I must confess, and I do not know the answer. The issue has been around for a long time with products, but its fairly new in information (which includes modeling and rendering) because of the internet.

I haven't looked at the survey results yet. It will be interesting...

[Michael Ruehr]

agreed 100 %

also i am now in Australia i lived and Worked
20 Years in India and you have my totall Unterstanding
for your Situation Do we Complain about Dirt cheep
computers manufactured in Asia "No"

so its good to get a little Broader Perspective on our
Financial Worries
We have some of the most exiting Jobs there is and Fun

Cheers Videha

[Jorge Tiscareño]

I am in total agreement with you Jack. I especially like your description of a typical day in a 3rd world country (having myself move to the US from Mexico).

And it is a double standard that you hear not only in our small niche but it is even in the current discussion of the US presidental race.

And the argument of some (or the majority) that it is exploitation, what about when we ourselves undercut the competition in order to get the job. Is that being called "exploitation". Like you said, let the work talk for itself and if a client likes it and wants to pay you for it, good.

We live in a democaratic and CAPITALIST country and the esence of capitalisim is market driven, and if somebody in another country does a comparable but less expensive job than someone in here, then I am sorry but the market will dictate what happens, just like it happnes with cars. Japan started building at first cheap cars then they got extremly good at it and now they are not that cheap but they are excellent and people buy them in droves in the US, but there is a niche for german, italian, british, korean, etc. And again it is all market driven. The customer has the final word in CAPITALISIM.

It is very hipocritical that all of a sudden people in the US cry, "exploitation", it is a double standard argument.

Demand and Offer, basic principal of capitalisim.

[Iain Denby]

Sometimes you read or hear things which totally alters your perception and perspective on something...it's just happened!

Thank you. I'm going to read it again and absorb it once more.

[Danny Meyer]

Hi Jack,

You make some good points about consumerism and the reverse flow of global wealth, and good luck to you in finding clients wherever in the world you like.

But don't anyone ever believe that the "1st world" companies employing "3rd world" services, labour, resources, whatever..are doing it to help anyone in the third world, improve their life.

They are simply finding ever cheaper suppliers, and usually pocketing the considerable savings themselves - and while they may benefit you, they are just depriving someone else. So 'Jack' wins and 'Joe' loses. That's life, but it forms no basis for a robust principle of economic justice.

US/Euro based 'Joe' is also a worker like any of us, and also has a mortgage to pay, kids to feed, etc etc, so robbing Peter to pay Paul for the benefit of a property development corporation's profits is just raw capitalism, red in tooth and claw.

Corporations nowadays are footloose, they have no loyalty to any of us...we are just pawns in the globalisation game, and rest assured that when SA, Argentina and China get too pricey - they'll just move along to Vietnam,Phillippines,Kenya...wherever.

It goes to prove how dangerous it is, in this economy, to try to compete on price alone.

Regards,

Danny.

[Jack Langner]

Good points and i agree with what you say. Especially the pawns part. And if we get too expensive and they want to look for someone else so be it. What I am trying to say is if you are good enough, you will never be unemployed and one shouldn't now all of a sudden try and change the rules of the game to suite you just because its getting a little harder.

"dont try and change the rules of the game, become a better player"

I am a white South African male. After my countrie's checkered past and process of reformation, it is very hard to get work as a white South African male. I am sick and tired of people around me, like my friends, wining about - "its not fair, afirmative action, reverse discrimination blah blah." Those people had it hard for 30 years now surely you can stomache a bit of a challenge. Its similar to our topic. The way i feel is ... stop wining, get off your b-hind, use the good education you have, and become as good as you can in something.

I know its not always easy, but such is life.

Thanx for the comments guys.

Render on!
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Create Creation

[Travis Schmiesing]

there are definitely 2 sides to this argument. i live in the U.S. i enjoy doing this work. you live in South Africa. you enjoy doing this work. you can do the work for a fraction of the cost i can, because your overall cost of living is less. the corporation, looking to save money, outsourcers the job to you . that is the nature of business in general. you make your money, and can feed your family, and pay your bills. good for you. good for the business.

....but the company that outsourced the work to you constructs bridges. they got a multi-million dollar contract from the state to build a bridge in a fancy downtown area. the bridge is being paid for with taxpayer money. i pay my federal taxes, i pay my state taxes, i pay my sales tax, ect.. ect... i helped pay for that bridge that is being built.

i work in the visualization field. the company needs someone to do a rendering of the bridge to show the public and the city. i submit my proposal, and you submit your proposal. our work is equally good, but your work cost 1/10 what my work does. the company goes with you to improve their bottom line. i was also counting on that job to feed my family and to pay my bills, but i can not compete.

i can not pay my bills if i offer a price that is competitive to yours. yes, i can take the challenge to get better, but even if i wound up twice as good as you, 1/10th the cost will likely win out when it comes to something as trivial as a rendering.

i understand that i am lucky to live in the U.S., and that i have more immediate resources than what you do. ...but why should this make me give up something i enjoy doing? likewise, i understand that you don't want to give up something that you enjoy doing either. we are in competition for the same work.

so the U.S. continues to outsource jobs to cheap labor in other countries, regardless of the field. somewhere along the way there is going to be a breaking point. at what point have you outsource to the extent that their are not enough jobs for the people here, so they can not afford the goods that are being produced by corporation who outsourced the job. since the company can not sell the goods, they can not make a profit. maybe they go under, maybe they don't. it depends on how rich they were to start, and what type of goods they sell.

....on the other hand, products produced by outsourcing are cheaper than those produced by in the U.S.. therefore, more people can afford to buy the goods here, and have a better life for themselves. ....but again, remember the breaking point. at what point do they no longer have a job, because all of the jobs went elsewhere.

we are living in a different time than the past. it is a global market. ...but the game of big business is to make more money at what you are doing, by doing it cheaper, and just as good as your competitor. as mentioned above, if the pay was equal on both fronts, then the competition would be equal, and i would not be arguing against outsourcing.

regardless of what you may think, i am a very open minded, liberal individual. outsourcing is not necessarily a bad thing, but it has to be done in a certain manner. otherwise it only benefits the rich getting richer.

bottom line. i want the job just like you. no one in the U.S. is getting rich doing arch. vis.. if i lose the job, i have to come up with another means of paying my bills. if you lose the job, you have to come up with another means to pay your bills.

i will stop rambling, i am not sure anything i wrote makes sense anyway.

[Travis Schmiesing]

basically what i was trying to stay, is outsorucing is a two way street. it has major implications on both sides. good and bad.

[Jack Langner]

Basically - the original point i was trying to make is that our third world countries support 1st world industries to a greater extent than the other way around.

More money is coming in to the US from 3rd world countries than out too 3rd world countries. I mean seriously how many 3rd world companies do you have in your home town. We have hundreds of 1st world companies here in my town. Its called multi national companies and the 1st world have most of them. Our companies here has been competing with 1st world companies for decades. Now the internet has given us a shot at your market.

I think where we will get at, if we talk about it long enough, is too a hand full of individuals which has a 3rd of the world's money leaving us to fight over the scraps.

There might be a braking point - or - there might be a gradual movement towards economical equality amongst countries. To something like a single unified currency. Its not unforseeable.

Its funny that if you think about it philosophically, the irony is that capitalism might one day create the level of equality which is the ideal of socialism. = Country gets richer - higher cost of living - ask more for your product - loose the job to somebody who'll do it for less - they get richer - higher cost of living - they ask more for theyr product - they loose job to someone else - ect.

Anyways the only reason for the original post was to make 1st world citizens attent to the fact that they get much more support from 3rd world countries than us from them and that we have beencompeting with their companies for a long time.

cheers

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Create Creativity
Sell Equality