Administrators Jeff Mottle Posted June 11, 2004 Administrators Share Posted June 11, 2004 Hi guys, I'm embarassed to even post this, but I have to get test renders out to a client tommorrow and I don't even know what I am doing wrong. This is my first Vray interior render and it sure as hell is no Lightscape. There are only 2 types of lights in the scene. Some fluorescent uplights on the top of the drop ceiling and the potlights. Unfourtunately even my attempts to do a low res test render too 40 minutes even with low setting and it looks like absolute crap. Where am I going wrong. I am using Free Point Lights for the potlights and Vray lights for the uplights. I've just uploaded an actual image of that same space. The finishes are changing, so I need to match the image as closely as possible and then add the new finishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Although I have been using vray for a while.... I've always problems with putting 'working lights' in. Post your gi settings and a screen grab of the viewport to see the lighting. Looks like your environment is black. Also that osmosis tutorial is excellent for interior scenes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Ramsay Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Jeff, post your render settings or send me the file and I will take a look for you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAT Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 you may also want to try the chaps out over at maxforums - http://www.maxforums.org/default.aspx?g=0 these guys are rather crude in their flaming techniques and language they use, but they know their stuff and reply ALLOT faster than our forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Ramsay Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Yeah also the guys on the V-ray forum respond quite fast to problems... just by looking at your render I can't tell what you are doing wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kippu Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 well i saw the picture and i saw its a nice render .. anyway ...a) u can speed up your TEST render by playing with the QMC settings amount=1 noise =1 and increase the hsp and int samples to 150 each ...more information on this in the chaos vray forum b) are you using photons ....if not think about it c) the gbuffer settings..... exponentianl /hsv works best for interior scenes i can tell you more if u can post the scene good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Warner Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 First thing I noticed was that you are using bucket mode for the GI....switch that to single frame, and that will get rid of one problem. Second thing is, make sure that in the VRay environment box, you have that set to override max's environment. Then it is a matter of playing with the GI quality to get rid of the splotchiness. -Chad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Ramsay Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Yeah IR maps dont work well on bucket mode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
proces2 Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 jeff, you really should post this in the vray forum (vrayrender.com) with a screen shot of your settings. my guess is that you are missing something with just the renderer settings. some quick tips though (if you are using vray advanced): -use all vray materials or add vraymaterialwrapper to standard materials. -don't use raytrace maps in any of your materials. -set all your lights to use vray shadows. -with the vray lights, check the store with irradiance map option. -are you using ies files with your lights - if so, those can tend to increase rendering time by quite a bit (its hit or miss though - some ies files don't increase rendering time - some do). -reference this tutorial when starting to use vray: http://www.osmosis.com.au/info/tutorials/studyhall_interior.htm -bucket mode will work fine for the interior shot for a progress rendering (even with IR) -set the color mapping to HSV exponential. most likely your will have to increase the dark multiplier. hope this helps, sean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Jeff Mottle Posted June 14, 2004 Author Administrators Share Posted June 14, 2004 Thanks guys for all your help and suggestions. Fourtunately Dave Knourek, one of our forum members, and a VRAY whiz from Calgary, stayed up till 3am with me via MSN to help sort the file out. By the time everyone posted, it had already been mostly figured out, and I spent the rest of the weekend, tweaking. I've attached the final images that I sent to the client, who is really happy with the final images. In the end, I was not able to use "real" lights, but fake lights to simulate the scene. A HUGE thank to Dave for helping figure this out and all the other settings as well. It's unfourtunate that Vray is not as good as Lightscape in that regards, but it definetly is a nice app, once you know how to use it. I've still got a LONG ways to go. Critiques, welcomed. PS. I did not chose that carpet, the client did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike68 Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 Congratulation Jeff on the improvment. I hope you can post the problem you had and the usefull solutions you were given, for us junior vray users to benefit. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 Fourtunately Dave Knourek, one of our forum members, and a VRAY whiz from Calgary, stayed up till 3am with me via MSN to help sort the file out. Wow. That's a lot of effort for an experienced renderer such as yourself for a program that is supposed to be so easy to get good results from. As much as I'm struggling trying to get something decent from mental ray, I'm wondering how much luck I'd have with Vray. I've never been brave enough to show anyone the "renders" I got from Vray Free last winter. As mentioned, it would be nice to know the solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Jeff Mottle Posted June 14, 2004 Author Administrators Share Posted June 14, 2004 Congratulation Jeff on the improvment. I hope you can post the problem you had and the usefull solutions you were given, for us junior vray users to benefit. Thanks Well you see all those potlights. Originally I tried making them all IES lights, but the image was virtualy black and took 45 minutes to render a simple 640 x 480 test image with low settings, then I tried individual direct lights for wach and that resulted in the image you saw originally. Dave took a look at the file and turned them all into one vray light that covered approximately the edges of the pots. To tweak how much the wall were lit up, I just moved or reduced the size of the vray light. The entire scene was lit with 2 Vray lights in the main area you see, and 1 behind the door at the end of the hall. There were also several vray lights what pointed upwards to light the droped ceilign bulkhead. As I started my career in Lightscape, I've never done "fake" lighting, which is what was required to pull this one off. Fran: Like I said my only real experience is in Lightscape and AutoCAD. I know my way around MAX pretty well, but belive it or not, until this project have never used it 100% in production. I'd always been meaning to but resisted becuase I was worried I'd not have the time if I ran into problems. The same thing went for Vray. There are plenty of much better renderers out there than me. (Like Dave) ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Knourek Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 Ive been using V-Ray since it was first avaliable to the public in Dec of 2002 and have loved it. And the main reason I have stuck with it was the killer service that I have received from the Chaos Group. Anyway there are a few bugs still being ironed out and for someone just starting to use V-Ray it can be confusing. But as someone else said the V-Ray forum is a great source of info and there is a relatively high level of professionalism maintained in the forum. Now Im fortunately able to work closely with the Chaos team in testing their internal build of V-Ray and can only say that V-Ray 1.5 will be faster, and easier to achieve a high level of quality. If anyone does have any V-Ray realted questions Im more than happy to help out if I can, just PM me for my email. Or Im allways here and in the V-Ray forums and on EFnet in #vray -dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Eloy Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 You know, this is quite weird... I mean, V-Ray has always worked well with IES lights (I'm actually rendering a project with a dozen right now). No real need to fake it with a V-Ray light... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Homeless Guy Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 ...are IES lights and Vray a no-no? ....I have been using them together for the last 2 or 3 months. some of my scenes render slow, but I have been decently happy with the results so far. occasionally i have to put a couple of non-shadow casting fill lights under the ground plane to get the walls and ceiling at the level i would like, but that is about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Knourek Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 The main reason was for speed. Ive used IES lights also with V-Ray with great success and great results, but also at quite a large hit in render time depending on the number of lights in the scene. Running with a couple dozen IES lights drives the render time way up and when ever in a crunch I usualy lean towards a combination V-Ray lights and spot/direct lights wiuth V-Ray shadows to achieve similar effects with far faster render times. And in my opinon at the time to get a similar result to the original photo and time to complete it was faster and easier to use the V-Ray lights. BTW Thanks for the kind words Jeff -dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher Nichols Posted June 15, 2004 Share Posted June 15, 2004 I'd have to agree with rick on this one... I have used IES lights in vray without any issues. I wonder if there is somethign else in your file which is incompatible with IES lights and Vray... Now that the project is over, it may be good to figure it out. I am sure you would like to know so that you can use IES lights on future vray renders. The guys over at Chaos Group are pretty good at debugging. You may want to fire them a quick email Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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