Is 3DS Max still absolutely necessary in this industry? What do you use?

[spencerrobertson]

Just curious if anyone here does NOT use 3DS Max and what your workflow is (if that's the case). I have experience with 3DS, but I'm strongly interested in alternate workflows given the lack of perpetual licenses in the future.

 

Thanks!

Edited May 24, 2018 by spencerrobertson

[spencerrobertson]

Also I wanted to add two more things.

 

1) Many assets seem to be in V-Ray and .Max. Anyone figure out a great way to convert these to their own platform? I'm curious if this will continue as the standard, since it's increasingly expensive and difficult for artists outside of large studios to even afford software.

 

2) I'm especially interested in Sketchup as a final solution. Now before you go laughing at me, hear me out. There are a huge amount of plugins that expand the possibilities and you can purchase and OWN the program. There is Skatter, that handles stuff similarly to Forest Pack. The V-Ray plugin is great and produces high quality results. There's Simlab's OBJ importer, which imports OBJ files perfectly with textures. The only thing that sucks a bit is the ability to handle large amounts of geometry, but that's easily remedied with using proxies. What's the drawback here if anyone has an opinion on that...I'm expecting backlash at even mentioning Sketchup haha.

[joshuahale1]

You can't go wrong with either Modo or Cinema4D, both of which offer perpetual licenses. I use Modo with Octane and it works quite nice together. I model most of my own buildings so Modo's toolset works well for that.

[spencerrobertson]

I guess the issue is assets in .MAX format. Often people need to buy assets and can't model everything. I see many in C4D too, but what's the best in your experience for ready-made assets? Are there great plugins for importing other files in both of these?

[bertabob]

I have taken a look at 3dsMax back when I was still a student, then I dropped it for Cinema 4D what I use since then.

I felt Cinema 4D is good enough for my needs and the learning of the software was very quick because its ease of use.

 

 

https://kallai.net

[Scott Schroeder]

It depends. If you are looking to work within a company, then knowledge of Max will give you the best chances at employment. If you are doing your own thing, that whatever software works for you.

[Ernest Burden III]

A simple visit to the CGArchitect Job Board will answer that--yes. If you plan to work alone--forever--then you can use whatever suits you. I have used Cinema4D for decades and love it. But when I entertain getting a real job, I realize I would be better off if I had MAX skills. Most jobs listed in arch-viz list it as a minimum skill.

[Jon Berntsen]

TBH, I don't follow the wish or need for a perpetual license. Why on earth would you need that? A perpetual license model in today's society is dinosaur. Even Autodesk isn't that dinosaur. As we all know, dinosaurs eventually loose.

[spencerrobertson]

There's a huge need for it. For freelancers and small studios, Autodesk has essentially tripled their price (or possible more) for customers. They've taken the decision out of their hands on WHEN they want to upgrade. It also gives software makers ZERO incentive to innovate and add new features, because they have you locked in to paying them for life. Add in ForestPack, RailClone and all other professional plugins and you have thousands and thousands of dollars of things you never actually own in any way, whereas you could use them for years until the software company gives you enough reason to buy with new great features.

 

I get what you're saying, but there's a difference between a reasonable annual fee, and one that was set up just to increase shareholder profits. This was a major change in 2016/2017 for people and their customers were not happy.

[Jon Berntsen]

For freelancers and small studios, wouldn't it be better, because you actually can afford it per month basis? And you get forced in updated functionality, which in a way is a very good thing in today's digital tech world. I respect your take on it, and it's an interesting discussion - because I didn't know this way of thinking still were around. I'm a retro dude, and this thread gives me a kind of Amiga retro people feeling.

Remember that every update can give you better performance. If you think that companies aren't founded by stakeholders, then you have to stop for a moment and take a look around you. All successful companies are driven by interest of increasing shareholder profits - and I don't see how Autodesk should be different.

[Josef Wienerroither]

Okay .... i just payed about some €750,- for my perpetual license renewal (w/o VAT, valid for one year ). And i can keep a functional, and officially licensed Max running until i die - without paying them any more. Compare that to the rental subscription price i would pay for one year: €1560,- (w/o VAT) Payed at once, per month would be even higher (= insane price if you are not in engineering/building whatever ). And i loose EVERYTHING after that year...

 

So tell me: is this really better and positive for small studios, one man bands ?

Of course Autodesk has the power to make it look better in the future if their userbase gives them the power to do so, because they can do things like stop selling perpetual alltogether ( already done ) and force up prices for the currently still lucky ones owning perpetual licenses...

But there is nothing positive in terms of rental subscription, especially when dealing a borderline customer hostile company like autodesk. Once they got the threshold customer numbers all on rental subscription, they will play the "how much can you pay" game with each one of them

 

I'm okay with paying rental, IF the company is trustworthy and offer pricing schemes which are fair to their userbase and leveled for various types of customers. I do that with Unity, which even offered my a grand reduction for the next 10 yrs of pro subscription, just because i'm a long time customer.

Heard anything like that from Autodesk ever ? ( not those mini 3-5% Autodesk styl reductions )

Edited May 29, 2018 by spacefrog

[Dejan Sparovec]

Remember that every update can give you better performance.

 

 

Not necessarily. Also, updating software can be a real hassle. If you use many different pieces of software together, like plugins, and you update one thing, you usually need to update everything else, and sometimes, not all of those updates are available immediately or at all.

[Ernest Burden III]

...As we all know, dinosaurs eventually loose.

 

Some, who were forest floor dwelling (so not dependent on trees so much when all the trees burned and died) survived and evolved and are now one of the most plentiful animal families on Earth.

 

 

Autodesk, and to a lesser extent Adobe, have done brilliantly at making their products necessary to work, to the point that governments require documents in proprietary formats. Yikes. ERSI's ArcGIS too, some GIS data is only publish in their format. And the software...talk about a dinosaur. And similarly, the arch-viz industry has largely institutionalized MAX as the default, must-use platform. The film/VFX industry has done similarly with Maya.

 

So MAX isn't absolutely necessary, but pretty much is.

 

EDIT - So we can conclude that being small and independent will pay off in 66 million years. We'll rule the nest.

Edited May 29, 2018 by Ernest Burden