Which program will do better for what I want?

[OOzypal]

Dears

 

I am not writing this question to start an endless discussion about which is better ArchiCAD or Revit; ArchiCAD or ADT. No, I am writing this question to tell what I would like to do and I would like you to tell me which program will do it better and easier.

 

First of all, I am not an Architect or Architectural Engineer. I am an Electrical Engineer. Meaning, I have no clue about this talented field.

 

Anyway, I just bought a land and I would like to build a 4 stories concrete building. I know that at the end I will have to go to a certified architect but until I am ready I would like to draw my floor plan then use ArchiCAD or Revit or any easy to use software to model the whole thing, i.e. install doors, lights, ceramic tiles, switches, everything. Then I want the program to give me bill of material i.e how many outlets I need and if it costs $1.4 then what is the total cost.

 

Also, I would like the program to tell me what is the concrete area i.e. how many cubic of concrete I need and their total cost.

 

Finally, I you recommend a software for me, would you please point me to a good tutorial or book for that software.

 

I really, hope that I did not confuse you.

[Tommy L]

I would strongly recommend consulting an architect or someone with the relevent experience. Your lining up a hell of alot of banana skins trying to do stuff yourself from the outset. And if your learning the 3d program in question? Your project will never get started. Good luck tho!

[mbr]

I agree with Tommy 100%. Having worked with many developers (both for architecture and 3D), I can honestly tell you that this is a common mistake. Don't assume that owning a program and knowing how to use it will make a decent building. We go to school for a long time (7 years for myself, bach and masters), go through internships, etc., get licensed, etc. It's a long path.

 

You are setting yoursefl up for a disaster, or, at the very least, a costly problem later on. Get an architect onboard to guide you through it. There are a million variables you won't know about, such as wheel chair turning radius, that you'd miss and it woudl cost more to revise things later on.

 

All too often a developer thinks they know how to design, and because it's all a numbers game, want to minimized cost. Understandable, but the last developer I worked with that did this ended up having to redesign his entire project because he failed to anticipate something crucial - it increased the cost of teh project by about 30% and decreased the profit by about the same - cost him millions! Not sure if that bankrupted him or not, but it would have been close.

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

...also, i don't know how it is where you live, but you are basically saying you want to design your building, then have an architect stamp the drawings for you. any architect in their right mind would shy away from this. by stamping the drawings they open themselves up to any lawsuits that concern the buildings design. be it wheel chair turning radius, windows falling out, anything.

 

most of the states here in the u.s. have some type of guidlines for the size of structure that an individual can design without seeking an architect. i think that most states do require an architect for a commercial building regardless of size.

 

i understand that this may seem like a simple thing, and depending on whether the building is designed or is a square concrete box, can be reasopnably simple. ...but, the standards and requiremnts are put into place due to many years of problems, lawsuits, and mishaps.

 

the laws are there to protect you, your cntractors, and the general public.

[DelfoZ]

archicad

at the end you are going to draw a building, but is not going to be architcture b'cuz you are not architect.

[Allen]

I agree completely with the previous responses...

 

It sounds more like you'd be at home with 'SketchUp' rather than a very deep and expensive Architectual program. This will allow you to model your concept in the shape and scope that you want - while communicating with your architect in a better way.

[Andrew Schroeder]

Well I agree for the most part with the previous responses, I disagree with Delfoz's comment about it not being architecture. A painting done by someone with an art degree is no more a work of art than one done by someone without the degree. Working up the design should be done with an architect, but I don't see why the prelim conceptual/rough-out cannot reasonably be done by the client. Of course an architect would shy away from stamping someone elses design, but I would expect the majority would offer their services to finalize and bring the design up to meet code, etc. (which I think is the original posters plan).

[OOzypal]

Ok guys/gals,

 

I DO totaly agree with you. May be I didn't make it clear enough. I will never do such stupid thing. Remeber I still think like engineers.

 

I still have 4-5 years to even begin constructing the building. What I wanted to is to play with a program in my free time and have an idea. The cost is no issue as my friends father's owns a big contracting company and they have many software that they never use and they will let me use one them.

 

I was just hoping that you point me to a software that they have such as archicad, autocad revit/ADT, punch something, chief architect and many others

 

Just assume that I am an architect.

 

Like you guys have some rules and codes in your carrier, we electrical enginners have codes and rule in doing our jobs. Like someone who is using small wire to carry high currents or so.

 

Thank you all very much

 

OOzy

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

...also, to suplement GI Dudes post, i would recommend starting off by building 3 or 4 quick chipboard models of want you want to have built. they should be no more than planes and masses. don't worry about windows or doors (at least at first), just the overall forms. as you start to develop a form, start thinking about the windows and doors.

 

this way, when you go to input your information into the computer, you will have a clear 3d sketch of what you are trying to construct.

[William Alexander]

chipboard models

 

Foam core & stick pins might be much easier I'd use a hard board or Medium density fiberboard, much cleaner cuts, if going the carpenters route

[OOzypal]

Ok ok ok ok

 

My hands are up. I surrender . I will do exactly what you all have said.

 

I will appreciate if you give me as much links to help topics as possible. I would like to spend my summer reading about your field. I choose summer because school will be off as I am doing my master in computer engineering.

 

I should have gone to architecture school instead .

 

BUT, I will surely be back when I am done with your advice.

 

By the way, I know AutoCAD very well as I use it to draw electrical stuff. I know this piece of information might not change your opinion but I thought it might support my case.

 

Any how, I really appreciate your valuable inputs.

 

OOzy

[William Alexander]

Your still in for a uphill struggle in revit, adt or Bim type app.

 

AutoCad- use poly's and extrude to create solids. Quite a few of us around here use AutoCad to model

 

WDA

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

By the way, I know AutoCAD very well as I use it to draw electrical stuff. I know this piece of information might not change your opinion but I thought it might support my case.

 

we are not trying to discourage you, just warn you. the software does not design the building, a person design the building. software simply helps you visualize, see, estimate cost, ect.. of the building. software is not needed to design a building. you can do everything from start to finish with a calculator, scale, paper, and pencils. basically, you could design your building with less than $10 worth of actual material.

 

it is the concept of design, the execution of design, the liabilities of design, the immense paperwork of design that is ahead. software only organizes all of this material in either words, lines, or pictures.

[IC]

I disagree with Delfoz's comment about it not being architecture. A painting done by someone with an art degree is no more a work of art than one done by someone without the degree. Working up the design should be done with an architect, but I don't see why the prelim conceptual/rough-out cannot reasonably be done by the client.

 

I disagree with this too. Would you say that Tadao Ando's work is 'not Architecture'?

 

He had no training-just talent and vision.

[Tommy L]

First thing you need is a pencil.

[DelfoZ]

For the first question of this Topic my answer is " Archicad"

 

 

---Offtopic of this thread---

 

i have a class with an architect (theoric of atchitecure, he did some pos grades and wrotte some books) i was expetic about that. but after that class i understand well why is not architecture, in fact the great greek buildings is not extricted architecture. Is a looooong debat about this. The greeks never did nothing thinking in architecture bcuz the word architecture didint exist in that time. the architecture start in another year( in some cultures the art was about maths, and the beuty things was about geometry etc). btw u can agree or not with me, but first read about what is and what isn't architecture. read some book about theory of architecture. not just pick a book with beauty images. my english dont letme explain as i wish, but im not inventing this theory, this exist and is true..

 

And Tadao can be the expetion of the rule, he can read and writte architecture, all the buildings of him have all the aspects of architecture.

 

u can writte a "peom" but is not going to be a poem bcuz u dont know nothing about rhytm, prosa etc etc. u can said , is a peom, but the true is that isnt a real peom.

 

i dont try to start a discussion abut this, im just said " u need to be an architect to do architecture" read and understand this, read some books, after that post a replay.

 

 

my 2 cents..

[joseph alexander]

Buy a copy of Rhino.. it has a very similiar interface as Autocad but is 3d oriented. You can do volume calcs, however I'm not sure if there is a good detail managment plugin for it.... It's very easy to learn and cheap, realtively...

 

-joe

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

the term 'architect' has more to do with legalities, than artistic expression and design.

[IC]

u can writte a "peom" but is not going to be a poem bcuz u dont know nothing about rhytm, prosa etc etc. u can said , is a peom, but the true is that isnt a real peom.

 

i dont try to start a discussion abut this, im just said " u need to be an architect to do architecture" read and understand this, read some books, after that post a replay.

 

IF your intention isn't to start a discussion, maybe you shouldn't make provocative statements. You don't have to be a poet to write a 'real' poem.

That's possibly the most elitist thing I've ever heard.

How many classical poets studied rhythm? All of them? I don't think so.

 

And I have read books, lots of them. I've also read many 'theories' from many different people. What makes a theory an unshakeable rule?

 

But then Architects are known for being elitist where I come from.

[DelfoZ]

in my personal opinion only the medics can open my body or givme some medicament . if some people like how the medics do buildings is ok. but not for me.

im not going to said nothing more about this .