Autocad vs 3dsmax

[bigroo]

Hi all,

 

I was wondering what would be the best or most favoured way to build architectural models, either in Autocad or 3dsmax. Essentially I or others will be rendering them in max in the end but I am at an ok standard of modelling in Autocad and not so in max yet. Is it just a matter of preference or does it help to start with one over the other.

 

Thanks

 

nb.I am only new to this and have noticed a large amount of very young ages - lucky you with all that time on your hands and no kids to distract you!

[Mario Pende]

Have you done any 3D modeling in AutoCAD?

If you have, stay with CAD modelers, but find some thats more suitable for 3D.

[bigroo]

Yes I have, only in Autocad (2000, 2005 & 2006). I use this as it imports directly into max. What CAD package would you suggest for modelling?

[doujay888]

well, this is just my own point of view. It's matter of choice in anyway but

a second opinion would be helpful as well. I started doing my models before

in autoCAD and importing them to Max for rendering. However, when I started

doing some models in Max I found it more comfortable with the interface

and easier to control and and meshes are more effecient and lighter. Till I

tried doing some research in Max modelling where I found it way more

easier than doing it in CAD.

 

Anyway an opinion will always stands as an opinion. It's up to you to

decide. For a change try to explore. I have a kid also.

[Mario Pende]

Yes I have, only in Autocad (2000, 2005 & 2006)

Im using Rhino3D and Catia.

Because you come from AutoCAD area I think Rhino would be a good starting point for your 3D work. Its realy powerfull and you will be on track in no time. Rhino started out as a AutoCAD plugin, so I think you get the picture here

[bigroo]

Thanks for the info on Rhino, I'll definatley take a look. Do they do a trial version?

[Hazdaz]

ALOT depends on what are you going to do with these models in the end?

 

If you are JUST using them for renderings (which to me seems like a HUGE waste) then you could just use MAX if you wanted to.

 

If you need to create actual blueprints from some or all of these 3D models, then there really is no choice - start with a CAD program and then import into MAX.

 

What I do sometimes is create the "overall" or more dimensionally crittical models in CAD, and then make all the smaller, "nick-nack" stuff in MAX, but that is cuz I know both methods of modelling. If you are more comfortable with just one, then go that route.

[Vince Paske]

this topic has been discussed many times in these forums, do a search - there are some interesting and heated threads.

Here's a start:

 

http://www.cgarchitect.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3519&highlight=modelling+max+autocad

[Mario Pende]

Do they do a trial version?

Yes.

[STRAT]

Rhino for architecture?? eewwwww

 

[Mario Pende]

Rhino for architecture?? eewwwww

 

http://www.aecbytes.com/feature/Gehry_Study.htm

 

[neil poppleton]

autocad and file linked to viz works very well, especially with changes that always happen along the bumpy road to completion...! as the link manager keeps a constant link for amendments,

[STRAT]

http://www.aecbytes.com/feature/Gehry_Study.htm

 

 

hehe, yep, i appreciate Rhino can obviously be used for architecture, as can any app, it's just more suited for 'organic' shaped structures. like the ones in the link there.

 

for more conventional architecture it's a pretty messy program to use imo. the meshes it produces are pretty erratic as far as mesh structure goes, and it uses faces and polys that more suit nurbs and curves. which is what its basically designed for.

 

and yup, i have rhino in my armoury too

[Mario Pende]

This is all just a matter of opinion and what is one capable doing with different tools.

it's just more suited for 'organic' shaped structures

But if it is suited for more complicated organic structures, wouldnt simple shapes be even more easier to create?! Think abouth it.

the meshes it produces are pretty erratic

See, this is a diference between experince Rhino user and non_experinced Rhino user.

Never let Rhino mesh your finished work!

Instead, always model with meshes if you want to export your work from Rhino to another program!!!

[bigroo]

this topic has been discussed many times in these forums, do a search - there are some interesting and heated threads.

Here's a start:

 

http://www.cgarchitect.com/vb/showthread.php?t=3519&highlight=modelling+max+autocad

 

Thanks guys, wow what a 'heated' subject!

[STRAT]

Thanks guys, wow what a 'heated' subject!

 

it certainly is, and the points been argued to the enth degree here numerous times before.

 

ultimately it's up to you. there is no right or wrong.

 

i personally am fluent in both, but always plump for acad modelling purely due to it's much faster work flow (ie, screen drawing and update) and infinate accuracy the max just doesnt give.

 

i josh about Rhino, which i also use, but it really is a personal choice. what gets the job done.

 

but hey, who needs infinate accuracy in visualisation - as long as your proportions are correct and you're 'more or less' accurate thats all that matters.

[bigroo]

infinate accuracy the max just doesnt give.

 

I was going to mention that I am struggling to get any true sense of precision coming from an ACAD background and that feels wrong. But I understand what you are saying about just aligning items onto surfaces or near to them, as long as the render has a realism to it. Perhaps now I'll stop fretting over this. Thanks.

[1eo]

This is all just a matter of opinion and what is one capable doing with different tools.

 

But if it is suited for more complicated organic structures, wouldnt simple shapes be even more easier to create?! Think abouth it...

 

 

 

hmmm, "no"... Simple shapes in rhino can take longer than one would expect and extreamly hard shapes can be done so fast and so easy that it's not funny..... The main reason is because Rhino is a Nurbs Modeling software.

 

Talking from experience

Most of my school work was done in rhino ( http://www.tereschubert.com/art/ ) for anyone who wants to see it

Another one

 

Regards,

Leonardo

[Mario Pende]

Talking from experience

 

Strange

...judging from your post "How can I become faster AutoCAD" I was geting impression that you are still struggling with AutoCAD.

 

 

I was going to mention that I am struggling to get any true sense of precision coming from an ACAD background and that feels wrong

 

...been there. Hate that feeling when you cannot draw a line 13 cm long in 2 moves, and then move it 2 cm in >33 angle in one move.

Thrust me, just try it.

[raysyu]

it is awkward to model in ACad. I did it 9 years before with Autocad 12, but when i jumped in 3d studio 4, a DOS version 3d program from which most of 3D max feature inherited, I immediately kicked out Autocad. I wanna correct some misunderstanding of 3dsmax, it does beat the precision of Autocad, 3ds max has very good numerical system, so please don't be fool. I just look around, and find out a lot of guys still use Autocad to model, they have to amend model and convert the model to max for rendering over and over again. is that wise? why don't you directly design and model in 3ds max, which is much easier and flexible to control geometries. So please don't be silly, dude.

 

Anyway, I am gonna post some tutorials in this forum for those who are still stuck in Autocad.

[Mario Pende]

So please don't be silly, dude.

 

...emmm, whos talking about AutoCAD?

[STRAT]

as Del said earlier, sounds like inexperience

to me it sounds like Max blinkered

 

 

I wanna correct some misunderstanding of 3dsmax, it does beat the precision of Autocad, 3ds max has very good numerical system, so please don't be fool.

 

that is incorrect. you can zoom in and be accurate to the Nth degree in acad. in Max this is physically impossible. it does have a good numerical system, but it really isn't a patch on a CAD program. and it isn't designed to be either.

 

 

 

I just look around, and find out a lot of guys still use Autocad to model, they have to amend model and convert the model to max for rendering over and over again. is that wise?.

 

you missunderstand the difference between cad and 3d render program i think maybe. you say "still" like we're way behind the times and acad is an old fashioned outdated way of doing things? as i say, i dont think you clearly grasp what cad really is.

 

you say converting an acad model to render in max over and over. is this wise?

 

of course it is, it's a standard practice. how else do we get from cad to max? we throw out cad? refer to my previouse reply. find out EXACTLY what cad is and look at it's massive market. they cant all be backwards in the times

 

 

 

why don't you directly design and model in 3ds max, which is much easier and flexible to control geometries. So please don't be silly, dude..

 

why max? why not rhino, c4d, maya etc etc?

 

i think it's you being a tad silly m8 there is no right or wrong. not better or worse. no faster or slower. it's all down to user preference. just because you find Max your fav tool thats fantastic. dont count the rest of us as being old fashioned and silly if we're not fellow max modellers.

 

i personally like a range of softwares. to keep my mind and modelling abilities open.

 

the point of the post has been made a zillion times. weather you like it or not, cad IS infinately better at precision design drafting that max or maya or c4d etc. max may be more flexable, easier and quicker in certain points of view, but it certainly aint more accurate. thats the whole point of the differenct applications.

[Vince Paske]

Actually, Autocad IS more precise than Max. Autocad is double precision, while Max is Single precision. I complete agree with Strat regarding everything else too.

[raysyu]

I am kind of straitforward, i have to say. But what i am provoking is not the simple techique of programs, but the capabilities of how computer program can assist design, how the vision could be deeply explored on screen, how the unique forms could be generated from the "accidents" of programs' advantages.

 

I am good at Autocad, 3dmax and Rhino, but i also look myself as an architect more than a computer grapher. With Autocad modelling, you can never escape the fate to do everything from 2d to 3d according to the UCS system. From this critical perspective, Rhino and 3D max do much much better, they evoke to think in real 3d and let you know how to manipulate and differentiate space by fantastic modifiers and nurbs system. Can Autocad give this kind of atmosphere?

 

the procision is already good enough for architecture design, i often plugin 3d max model to autocad drawing, and never have any trouble. What i suggest here is, don't go across too many programs that will never give efficiency. Even for generic buliding, which doesn't need too many creative points, going back and forth between CAD and MAX is a pain, you'd better choose AccuRender with autocad.

 

as far as i am concerned, Autocad can only help finish the model, but 3D max and rhino are beyond modelling.

[joseph alexander]

I'd have to agree with Lei.. we recently completed a competition entry for The Nascar Hall of fame which we never would have been able to complete without Rhino.. it lead to design process where I sat down with a principle and project manager and designed in realtime 3D and used the model to inform the CAD drawings. In addition, from rhino we got an .STL for a 3D print.

The main problem with 3D is that there is so much involved in making a model that you sometimes lose track of real design problems. In my opinion, you really have to work in AutoCAD and with trace to solve problems..

 

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