System for working interactively

[Fermi Bertran]

Hi,

 

About to acquire a new sytem for VIZ4 interactive work and having serious doubts

 

Question is what will behave better:

 

A P4 2,53 or a Dual AMD 2000+ ?

 

Video card will be Quadro 4 750 XGL either way

 

Budget is limited, otherwise I'd go for a dual Xeon 2,8 Ghz making sure to have hyperthreading on ;o)

 

Of course I understand that rendering, or radiosity processing the dual amd would kick the P4 ass, but that's not what I am after just now, but modelling and handling medium to heavy architectural scenes instead, both wireframed and shaded, in the range of 200k to 2million poligons or so...

 

I've read on several reviews that in the viewports the amd lower bandwidth is a narrower bottleneck than the P4, specially with the 533 FB, not allowing the video card to perform at it's best.

 

May be someone who's tested both systems may shed some light

 

Today I am interactively working on a Single AMD XP 1900+ with a GF2 Ultra, it does not perform bad, but I am looking forward really noticiable improvement.

 

thanks

 

[ November 01, 2002, 11:48 AM: Message edited by: FB ]

[mbr]

Fermi,

 

I have been looking into buying almost the same system and would be interested in peoples responses (I posted asking about a refurbished Dell Dual 2.2 vs. a new dual AMD 2000 XP - most said go with the AMD). If you are using Max, it has been optimized for the P4, which would make a difference. I've also read that the AMD's render much faster than the Xeons. Personally, unless I find a great deal at Dell's refurbished site (I bought a ref. 2.2 and it is perfect! I love Dell's support and attention to detail, it was well worth it, but they go fast), I will probably go with a dual AMD.

Alienware has a dual AMD 2200 now, very reasonably priced (not sure if they ship to Spain), with many options and a solid reputation. Check it out:

http://www.alienware.com/main/system_pages/mj12%20ddr.asp

[Fermi Bertran]

Hi MBR,

 

Thanks for the feedback.

 

I am looking for interactively working performance just now, that's what arise my doubt, hoped someone like Greg, who might have tasted both, the Intel and the AMD with the same video card, could tell the experience (not necessarily indeep testing, feeling when handling geometry would do)

 

I know at the same nominal speed, AMD spins around Intel when rendering, but that's not main concern now.

 

Have my hardware suplier here in BCN priced the following systems:

 

P4

-Asus P4B533 sock 478 DDR w sound

-Intel P4 2.53/533

-Mem DDR PC2700 512 Mb X 2 (1024 total)

-HD Seagate barracuda 60 Gb Ata 100 7.200

-1,44 floppy

-logitec deluxe acces keyboard

-logitec pilot mouse

-Not specified the box, but imagine iron cheap box.

-Pwer Sup. Enermax 460W PIII/P4

-10/100 PCI fast Ethernet

-CD RW LG 40x12x40

-Asus V8420 DT Geforce 4 Ti 4200 128 Mb

-Win 2K Pro

 

Total 1,371.88 Euro

 

The AMD:

 

-Tyan tiger MPX Dual AMD K/ MP

-AMD MP 2000+ x 2 (2100+ not available nor 2200+)

-Mem DDR PC2100 Registered 512 Mb X 2 (1024 total)

-HD Seagate barracuda 60 Gb Ata 100 7.200

-1,44 floppy

-logitec deluxe acces keyboard

-logitec pilot mouse

-Not specified the box, but imagine iron cheap box.

-Pwer Sup. Enermax 460W PIII/P4

-Soundblaster 128 OEM

-CD RW LG 40x12x40

-Asus V8420 DT Geforce 4 Ti 4200 128 Mb

-Win 2K Pro

 

total 1,723.43 Euro.

 

They put the systems together and give one year guarantee for the parts.

 

Will take the GF 4200 out and use it in another system to upgrade a TNT2,

Will get from a different supplier the PNY Quadro 4 750 XGL, best price I've found around is 816,00 Euro.

 

And, if I reach a decission, that's all

 

[ November 02, 2002, 06:58 AM: Message edited by: FB ]

[Fermi Bertran]

Well,

 

What I mean exactly is what credit should be given to this article, first part: working in the viewports comparison, in real life:

 

http://www.xbitlabs.com/cpu/3dmax5-p4-xp2800/

 

thanks

[Greg Hess]

Watch out for xbitlabs...they sometimes post some odd results. Always make sure with any review, to back it up with other reviews on the web. Data is useless unless its reproducible.

 

As for viewport performance...your looking at single CPU performance over a dual's performance. Though a dual has many advantages, it will always lose vs a faster single cpu in a single threaded task. Currently D3D and OGL are single threaded operations, which means that only the primary cpu is engaged. So if you had a single 2200+ XP vs a Dual 2000+ MP, the 2200+ XP would have a higher performance ceiling in the viewports.

 

The latest #'s from AMD and Intel are indicating that the next rev of AMD's chips (The 2400+ and above) are out performing Intel's flagship processors in the viewports. (Based on specviewperf data). Though this needs to be examined more closely....It means once again performance is flopping around.

 

Which means...either system you buy will be more then enough performance wise.

 

If you can wait, wait until after Nov 14th, as many new chips, technologies, and even video cards will be hitting the market around that date...which of course will drive down the prices of everything previous.

 

So wait.

 

Its only a few weeks away.

[Fermi Bertran]

Thanks Greg,

 

>>So wait.

 

Its only a few weeks away.

 

Well, I've been holding the undecision for a while, I'll see if I make up my mind this weekend

 

faster MP available today here is the 2000+ so, as you see, there is some dealy respect the states, the new P4 3.06 due nov. 14th, may reach us in January or Feb... may be by Easter :-p

 

I prefer duals, so I'll probably go for the dual AMD now, it was that you had been more "tolerant" with P4 since the Northwoods, and those reviews about viewport performance... , shall rely on the MAXTreme and the Quadro4 for the viewports mainly

 

May be next year's upgrade will be a hyperthreaded P4 or the 64 bits amds, meanwhile I'll sleep quietly because I know you'll be testing the new technologys

 

thanks again and so long

 

Fermí

[Greg Hess]

Hey Fermi,

 

New MP Athlons for the states are slated for a Dec release. (Thats the most current MP data I have on athlons). So that would probably mean marchish for you .