What to do to improve??

[ryandi]

hi all,

My boss wants to improve the quality+rendering time in our office

 

Right now we're using pentium IV 2.8 Ghz, 1Gb memory using 3Ds max+vray

 

I have few suggestion, but still confuse which one to choose:

 

1. go to dual opteron 275

2. go to lesser than opteron 275 + buy maxwell render

3. buy a professional render card (such as PURE)

 

Budget is open...but I don't want to abuse it, hehe

So I'm having problem to choose what is the most optimal thing to do

 

Really appreciate if anyone can help or gives another option

 

Thanks!

[STRAT]

1. - good choice

2. - maxwell will do the EXTACT OPPOSITE to speed up your rendering m8.

3. - good idea

 

 

basically, go buy anything dual, and maybe an extra gig of ram. that'll double or treble your max/vray performance.

[hidr]

I agree with Strat.

 

Generally hardware is a good choice to improove rendering time but for the quality, I don't know, may be the hardware is the easy way to improve that too.

 

I am not trying to be bad, but if I had a great hardware, I couldn't improve my quality that much, may be your boss should pay for some training or tutorials, or books, too.

 

Post some images if you want.

[mbr]

Get yourself the fastest dual processor you can. I'd skip the PURE card- big bucks and doesn't support GI yet (to my knowledge), it's just to specific for general purposes.

 

If he'll buy more than one, get one great machine, best processors (I am still a intel guy, and only Dell simply due to their onsite support and insanely quick repair times), then get a second machine (or two) for rendering. I have several machines that I work on, I'd be 50% less productive if I only have one machine to work on.

 

Get a big screen, too, it helps tremendously. I love Dell's 24" - I dont' like dual monitors (personal preference, but 24" is prefect size for 3D, imho)

[cabarchitect]

First Things First...this is my first post and I hope to have some good stuff to offer.

 

I have to agree with hidr and mbr...hardware is critical in boosting rendering speed and quality (quality takes time and only hardware can handle the reduction). However, it doesn;t take a huge amount of hardware to produce high quality renderings quickly. We also use Dell machines...mostly Precision 470 Workstations with Single 3+ Ghz Xeon processors and a gig of RAM. The key to the whole puzzle is having a machine (or machines) that are solely dedicated to the rendering process. If you are loading up other programs that are used in the daily business cycle (e-mail, word processors, all those games we shouldn't be playing during work hours, etc.), you are using valuable real estate and resources. Also, the OS should be as minimized as possible to help on the resource side. If you are using a LAN, bandwidth becomes an issue if the rendering data is required to flow through the infrastructure. We have found that, even if the computer is networked, copying the files locally before doing anything can really help reduce analysis and rendering times. Final thought...display and rendering can be helped with a great (not just good) graphics card and a high quality display (and that won't hurt when you can resist the urge to play BF2 or something). Hope I helped.

[Greg Hess]

I'd skip anything with intel at this point. The price/performance just isn't there, especially in the Xeon lineup. You need to be pushing a 3.6-3.8 xeon to even make a dent in AMD's performance advantage.

 

Not to mention Intel's new processors (the duocore lineup) are actually significantly faster then their own xeon lineup, with a 1.83 ghz dual core Intel outrendering a dual 3.0 Xeon in 3dsmax/vray.

 

Intel is well aware of this fact, which is why they are pushing for their new cpu architecture this fall (labeled conroe). Conroe (if benchmarks hold true) should actually bump intel back up into the performance crown. But right now, you'd be better off buying intel duocore laptops if you wanted render performance instead of xeons. (Before anyone gets really mad, I own a Dual 2.8 Xeon, so its not as if I want a little laptop to outrender my workstation either).

 

I'd say either go with dual opterons, or single X2/Opteron Dual cores if you want a lot of relatively inexpensive farm additions. If you are looking for an OEM to sell you those boxes, look into http://www.boxxtech.com. If you have to go through dell, you'll have to wait a good number of months before dell uses the alienware license to push the AMD processors.

 

Below is a repaste of my post in a previous thread in this forum.

 

AMD Dual cores are currently the performance and performance/cost leaders. This may change in the next 6 months, but right now, even single dual core Athlon's put Intel's lineup to utter and complete shame.

 

Its pretty depressing when you sit there with your dual 2.8 Xeon, running Vray (with its four buckets going), and a 2 ghz Opteron dual core blasts past your system like it was sitting still.

 

Basically if you wanted a crazy fast system, and didn't have alot of money to throw around, a single processor dual core system running an X2, FX, or 16x series opteron or faster, will blow past most non amd systems.

 

In fact, Intel's own new coreduo seems to be beating their previous P4 architectures by an impressive margin. People are buying 2 ghz laptops and watching them out render their dual 3 ghz Xeon machines.

 

And all this assumes we are talking purely 32 bit operating systems and 32 bit programs.

 

Here's some quick clips from the egz vray benchmark off the vray forums.

 

A dual 2.8 Xeon renders the same scene in 6 minutes and 20.5 seconds. (HT enabled)

A single AMD X2 4200+ (2.2 ghz X2 Dual core) renders the scene in 5 minutes 58.9 seconds.

A dual 270 opteron (2.0 ghz Dual core x (4 total)) renders the scene in 3 minutes 24.8 seconds.

A dual 285 opteron (ludicrous speed) renders the scene in 2 min 24 seconds. (4x 2.6 ghz)

 

I'd say right now, a Single 2.0 ghz dual core AMD is roughly equivilant to (or faster then) TWO 2.8-3.0 ghz Xeon processors (with HT enabled).

 

From the intel side of things, a single 1.8-2.0 CoreDuo is roughly equivilant to (or faster then) TWO 2.8-3.0 ghz Xeon processors (with HT enabled).

 

And yes, this means all the new upcoming laptops beat the crap outta everyone's old workstations, including mine.

 

Another interesting thread on a similar discussion of "WTF?"

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=334734&page=1

 

It should be noted that this type of information is only valid right now. You've got ALOT of new technology coming out this year, including new sockets for both AMD and Intel, new graphics cards, possible laptop flash drives (no hd's!), insano. Intel's new processors are supposed to be 20% faster then AMD's fastest current offering, at least from grain of salt prelim benchies.

__________________

[cabarchitect]

Listen to Greg...he knows what he is talking about. It was not my intent to pitch Xeon as a top performing alternative, but to provide an example of what our firm is capable of doing with relatively minimal hardware. Our speed lags somewhat, but we feel this is more the result of using older software than any limits our hardware capabilities might present. We can still produce exceptionally high quality stills of architectural 3d models (some approaching the 4-5 million polys), it just takes a few hours to crank them out. Based on the information provided by Greg and also posted other places around the forums, Dual Opterons could run circles around even me .

[AJLynn]

That's a lot of response already, but I'd just like to add that in general, more hardware = better render times, but training + practice = better quality. Unless you have specific knowledge that faster render times will get you better quality, e.g. you've been making compromises in your materials, lights and render settings because you don't have enough power to render them inside your deadline.

 

Unless you're already very confident in your Vray skills, try investing $120 in a set of Global Illumination training DVDs.

[Frosty]

I agree with Greg and AJ.

Improving skills will improve your renderings and can improve render times just as much as more/faster hardware.

 

When it comes down to the "just gotta have the fastest thing available and i dont care what it costs"....Meet King Kong

http://www.boxxtech.com/products/apexx4.asp

Quad Dual-core Opterons.

[Greg Hess]

Ya I haven't said that in awhile. I completely agree with skill > hardware. Faster hardware always allows for artists to be a bit...sloppier in their models, scenes, methologies. If you can get away with a 100k polygon object now with the new power, why waste the time cleaning it up to be 10k, if won't effect the final output? Scene optimization and tweaking can net you advances in performance just as much as new hardware will. The display floater is your friend!

 

The best bang for the buck right now, (if you are building yourself), is a single dual core athlon X2, 4200 or 4600+ (I like the 4600+ myself a bit better, because 200 dollars for 400 megahertz is still a deal in my eye).

 

This config gives you two processors (faster then a dual single core system of similar speed), and lets you use the cheaper ram (instead of registered ECC), and the fastest board/chip features on the market, not to mention most of the motherboards are 1/3 to 1/4 the price of their server brethern. You also skip out on having to purchase expensive EPS power supplies.

[ryandi]

Many, many thanks to every each one of you who have share your comments to help

It's all very useful information..

 

Hehe, I agree that hardware is not the most promising thing to raise render quality,speed yes, quality...dunno

But things are a little bit hard to improved with such limited hardware..

At home I'm still work with my old computer, sempron 2600+, 512mb ram, and it took hours to do vray prepass calculation...

So, i'm thinking, maybe with much better hardware I will be able to do more practise with much lesser time and higher settings

...as the result i'm hoping the quality also will improve

 

AJ, I'm considering that tutorial dvd you suggest&will talk to my boss..hehe thanks

 

Greg, thanks for sharing great info about that AMD procs...big help!

 

the rest of you, strat, hidr, mbr, cabarchitect, frosty...once again, thanks guys

[cabarchitect]

 

the rest of you, strat, hidr, mbr, cabarchitect, frosty...once again, thanks guys

 

ur welcome....hope to have helped you in you quest! As a result of getting involved, we are investigating upgrading our software and hardware in an attempt to "take it to the next level."

[jophus14]

I will be buying parts this up coming weekend to build a new computer setup. My computer at home is older and slower then I need for working on my images using Max and Vray. I was told to go with an Intel processor, but I'm thinking more along the lines of AMD. I have roughly $800-$1000 to spend on a motherboard, processor, Ram, and video card. Any suggestions?