buffos Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Is anyone on the maxwell forum ever going to announch any info about maxwell? Reading the forum ,in a thread about someone asking for news that eventually resulted in fry v maxwell thread, made me once again pessimistic. Beside that, is mverta on medication? talking about scumbags? i guess NL owns the holy grail of honesty, innovation etc etc.!!! Another well known compatriot, is really driving me crazy. He is asking what is the release date of fry. I really wonder. Does that individual know WHAT IS THE RELEASE DATA of MAXWELL? Maxwell is still in ALPHA. Whatever they might try to say, Maxwell is missing a dozen PROMISED features. I wonder do those individuals get paid to say profound inaccuracies? I really wonder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adehus Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 'Scumbag' is pretty much it... and it is comical how many treat Maxwell as religion. That thread had me laughing from start to finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 I'm really getting tired of the fan boys defending Maxwell, one of Maxwells defenders actually said this about Fry when I said the lack of info coming from NL was going to drive people over to Fry. ... and has only one plugins (plus a "promise" for maybe another) and a vague "promise" of a future 1.0 release having an indefinite (unknown and unknowable) deadline that requires conjecture, hearsay and crystal ball type assessments (in a process no different or more accurate than making lucky picks in a horsetrack) to formulate a hypothesis that "maybe" it is developing fast ... and just "maybe" it will be done sooner. I really don't understand how someone can say this about one company but be totally loyal to another that does the same thing or worse. Anyway as usual not one person from NL has made a comment in over 6 pages of text. These guy's are never going to learn and it's going to be their downfall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernest Burden III Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 when I said the lack of info coming from NL was going to drive people over to Fry. Because of what NextLimit has done I think Fry is going to be judged on its own. Yes, there are a list of obvious points of comparison, but all will be skeptical in a very healthy way about Fry and anything that company says. The problem is that early on many of us bellied up to the Maxwell KoolAde bar and drank ourselves silly. I doubt that will happen again, at least not to the extent it did then. I haven't touched Fry yet, but have followed their forum recently, as there is word of a Cinema4D plug in the works. So far the product shown tremendous promise. Fran likes it a lot, and I trust her opinion. So once she posted some of her work with the beta, I started paying attention. As for NextLimit, what are we to do? They are who they are and they behave however they please. They drove me away, but many are still loyal, so to each his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
u.biq Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Dare I say I agree with you morons ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_PopArt Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 I saw that they insult fryrender programmers (scumbags) and insists that it is BS and cant do reflective caustics while people are posting fry images showing that it does reflective caustics. Great bunch of people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 Yea it's a big old drama, one that I'm really tired of and wish would go away. Anyway it's been proven now that Fry can do reflective caustics so I guess they will have to find something else to bash. The whole point of that thread was to ask NL for some information regarding the next release, no one from NL has responded yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbad Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 The whole point of that thread was to ask NL for some information regarding the next release, no one from NL has responded yet. And while we're comparing, I find it really interesting you can get an answer on the Feversoft forum to just about any question within a couple minutes. They're not afriad to tell people "no" either. The guy even knocked out a feature in a couple hours that Maxwell still hasn't managed to get in. And I haven't seen any customers called morons or competitors called scumbags either. As a latecomer to the whole Maxwell party I never really understood all the animosity that surrounded them, but I'm starting to get it now. Thank god for competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted October 31, 2006 Share Posted October 31, 2006 As a latecomer to the whole Maxwell party I never really understood all the animosity that surrounded them, but I'm starting to get it now. The problem with NL and Maxwell is they have gone back on their word so many times that no one except the fan boys believe anything they say. Not only that but they have actively lied to their customers on more than one occasion and that is what really destroyed their credibility. Then you have ex-moderators like Mike and Tom who came in to try and calm down the forum only to wind up insulting and provoking the members to the point that some of them wound up being banned. It's truly a horrible mess and one that I hope the Fry guy's have learned a lesson from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 I have no words. I'm pretty wrung out from receiving unrelenting character attacks from Thomas An on the public forum, and verbally abusive pm's from mverta. Those people are whacko. Beware if they offer you tin foil hats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernest Burden III Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 unrelenting character attacks from Thomas An on the public forum, and verbally abusive pm's from mverta. Now you see, Fran, you're a much more andvanced human than me. I used to draw the ire of old StoneFace, and had Mike on the phone talking NextLimit stuff. But now I'm not even on their radar. You are still drawing fire. You must be doing something good. I don't think either Mike V or Thomas An. are bad people. But I'll take the crowd here any day. And its time to stop thinking of Fry as the anti-maxwell. It is whatever it is, nothing more. In the end, all the Maxwell fans can be stacked in a pile and it still doesn't weigh as much as the opinion of my friend Fran. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leoA4D Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 I read those outrageous posts in that thread. I am one of the banned for having violated mike's rules and I never used such language and certainly never attacked anyone. Anyway, I received an *extremely polite and warm* reply email from NL today a-n-d within two hours after my email went out! Sharing this much should be okay: "We are working very hard to make Maxwell better and better and we want you are very happy with it." It didn't give any details or make promises and yes M~R still has lots of issues but IMO, NL's email was more than professional and completely sincere. Nicole (I do not know Nicole's title or job) has offered prompt answers with aplomb and a calm voice in some tough situations. Small but hugely significant improvements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffos Posted November 1, 2006 Author Share Posted November 1, 2006 First if i could respond to the maxwell forum, they would ban me again in 2 secs. Why? Because those guys live in LIES. Frances don't even read what that m***n writes. The difference between the 2 camps is obvious. Every question is answered in the fry camp with FACTS, and not with what the user wants to hear so you can find them nice and with LIES from the other camp. They asked for info about what is going on, and nicole said in the beginning of Nov they would release a news letter. No comment on that BS. After a year of another alpha release (what they called v1) they dont have concrete answers of what is implemented or not. The progress is minimal and no information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_PopArt Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 And its time to stop thinking of Fry as the anti-maxwell. It is whatever it is, nothing more. Looking at that thread that is now gone (the few things said between all of that hatred and insults) i got the idea that fry render IS maxwell, the same core engine being redeveloped from the alpha fase. Does anybody know what is really going on? The chances that there are two really well developed mlt engines that make almost identical images is slim. That both come from Madrid is even slimmer. Does anybody know what happens behind the scenes? Are fryrender programmers ex NL programmers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adehus Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 Even after NL hand picked who they wishd to have participating in their forum, they *still* can't keep it civilized, or keep their own representatives from insulting everyone. It was nice to see, though, that nobody bought into Verta's BS. That represents quite a change, and I'll go out on a limb and suggest that it has some fairly negative implications for NL and it's future. While many were excited about NL's product, few were excited about NL itself. Now it's becoming clear that the product and the company are essentially one and the same, and that the quality of the people NL surrounds itself with is directly reflected in the product. If the same can be said for Fry, I think they've got a bright future ahead of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 Does anybody know what happens behind the scenes? Are fryrender programmers ex NL programmers? NL and Feversoft have both said that there is no relationship between the two companies. As to whether Feversoft is using ex NL employees is a good question, I find it absolutely wacky that Fry is in almost every way a complete duplicate of Maxwell even down to the way it stores it's data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 I'm really amazed at the arrogance that NL continues to exhibit, that entire post that was almost 10 pages long has been removed from their site. How can these guys’s keep going when they continue to give the big middle finger to everyone that uses their product? I’m really angry right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 Is it not true that the technology behind Maxwell and Fry is relatively old? I thought it was the way it has been harnessed (ie bundled into a user friendly engine the type of which we are accustomed to) that is new and will probably form a 'next generation' breed of product so I'd imagine Fry is just the first of many to come along in Maxwell's wake. It's only natural they should at least mimic the format of Maxwell since that's the way of technology based business. The legality of it is another matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbad Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 The thread didn't stay up very long, but mverta essentially accused them of having stolen code. If true, there is surely pending litigation on the matter and letting someone run their mouth about it on a public forum would be extraordinarily stupid. If untrue, libel is just as actionable in the EU as it is in the US. The whole thing is a tiresome mess. NL needs to focus on developing their product. And if they are going to run a forum at all, they need to moderate it themselves. As it is they have unpaid (?) representatives possibly getting them into legal trouble. I have no idea if there really is some kind of shenanigans behind the development of Fry, but I'd certainly like to know before I possibly buy it. Of course, I'd have no reason to even consider buying it if NL did a better job of developing Maxwell. I sat through half a dozen crashes yesterday, which added at least an hour to the project I was working on. My patience for software that continually costs me money is very low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 Again that entire thread was a simple call for NL to give the community some information on the upcoming release. There was no need to let it get out of control; it's their fault for not properly moderating the situation. The removal of the thread is only going to make people more upset with the way things are going, does NL really need any more bad feelings directed at them. If Fry has broken laws, and we've already had this discussion, but if they have then we may not find out until one day when their site is just gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rivoli Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 that entire post that was almost 10 pages long has been removed from their site. I don't think that's totally a bad thing. that thread got completely out of hand, with all those insults and cheap insinuations toward people like fran and dave who sure don't deserve a bit of that crap. so I'm actually glad I don't have to read any more of that pile of bs. besides this is old news, I mean that's the way things used to be over at the maxwell board not very long ago. deleting posts and threads over night as if they were never there that is. I can understand that the maxwell forums are not the right place to talk about any other renderer than maxwell, as the fry ones are the right place to talk about fry and the chaos ones to talk about vray. as long as they are all specific renderers boards, I guess it's always better if you keep them on topic. with this being said, that thread shouldn't even have gotten that far, it should have been actually moderated and locked around page 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devin Johnston Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 I don’t think it's inappropriate to be comparing the capabilities of other engines to the one your using which part of that thread was trying to do. I can see why NL doesn’t want any other engine mentioned on their forum but it's going to happen that's just the nature of the business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adehus Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 besides this is old news, I mean that's the way things used to be over at the maxwell board not very long ago. deleting posts and threads over night as if they were never there that is. It just reminds everyone that NL is the same as it always has been, and any suggestions of change or reform are utter baloney. While the Fry folks are busy answering questions and providing users with real solutions, NL is still up to the same old crap and providing users with nothing new of worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leoA4D Posted November 1, 2006 Share Posted November 1, 2006 "Baloney for sale!" "Get your red hot Coney Island baloney right here!" "How do you want your baloney?" Egads, here I am in dejá vu! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 I noticed in the midst of the fray where Thomas An stated that RS2 has been shelved. I hope nobody was holding their breath waiting for that innovation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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