Fryrender

[CHE]

Hi all,

 

I just wanted to get some insight from people that are using Fryrender in their workflow as their primary render engine. I am a Maxwell user that finally got tired of waiting for Nextlimit to deliver a finished product and am ready to move on. I would like to hear about the learning curve and any issues that Fryrender has currently.

 

Thanks,

Ernesto

[Fran]

Hi all,

 

...I am a Maxwell user that finally got tired of waiting for Nextlimit to deliver a finished product and am ready to move on...

 

But they are soooo close. It would be a shame to give up on them now. I'm only partly kidding. What host app are you using? What is it about Maxwell that makes you say it is unfinished? If it is speed, you will likely not be happy with any unbiased renderer. If it is features and stability, then Next Limit could argue the case that Maxwell is a finished product, even though it is missing key features that were promised in the alpha and beta stages. If it is integration with your host app, then that is being improved. For example, the max plug-in is supposed to be greatly improved for the next release.

 

I'm just finishing a fairly large production with fryrender, and I'm very happy with the results. The learning curve for fryrender is about the same as Maxwell - not a lot of arcane knobs to tweak. The material model is not quite as complex (or irritating) as Maxwell's, which you may find a plus or a minus. As for issues, I can't say because the version I'm using is ahead of the current customer beta. A lot of things have been added, fixed and improved since the current release.

 

If I were you, I'd keep my eye on the next releases of both Maxwell and fryrender. That will help you decide better than anything else.

[Devin Johnston]

I'm in agreement with Fran here, even though Maxwell isn't what was promised in the beginning it certainly is capable of producing stunning studio work as it is now. There's no doubt that they still have some work to do in order to make it robust and user friendly but it's by no means useless. What kind of issues are you having?

[Ernest Burden III]

I consider myself a former Maxwell user, and I have 4 licenses. I used it for a few minutes here and there, always hit walls, not worth the effort.

 

I've been watching Fry and the company behind it closely for several months. I read their forum, participate even, and am welcomed like a customer. Its a positive learning environment with supportive people and a promising, unfinished product. Its only remarkable in the light of what we went through with NextLimit. So I've written off my investment in Maxwell and plan to buy into Fry when it fits in with the old cash flow. OK, Fran told me to. But I listen to her.

[CHE]

Hi again and thanks for the info. Don't get me wrong, I have also produced some fairly nice illustrations with Maxwell. I only have one license so the initial investment has paid itself off more than a few times already. However, I can't said that I am completely happy with Maxwell as it is right now nor am willing to put up with Next Limit's unethical behavior any longer. The software has some very ugly issues and I just can't see them getting fixed any time soon. ("True" glass material, Network rendering, complex material editor, alpha channels and clip maps to mention a few). Also, V1.1 is a cry far from the beta quality that we came to love IMHO.

 

In any case, I just wanted to gather some information from those who have working experience in production with this new render engine before I hand in the cash.

 

Fran,

Does Fryrender have the same glass issue than Maxwell? How well does it handle interiors? Have you had any issues with clip maps and alpha channels? How easy is to set up materials? Are you using a plug-in, the stand alone application or both? Is this a windows only application? If so, do you know if Feversoft have any plans to develop an OSX version in the future? If possible, Could you post some of the most successful renderings you have done with Fryrender?

 

Thanks,

Ernesto

[F J]

get on Fry's forum dude

[ki_cz]

Is the fryrender material system similar to the beta stage maxwell material system, or is it closer to the new material system? I really don't understand why there couldn't be a beta material system with coating, specular maps and better functioning glass ...

[Ernest Burden III]

Does Fryrender have the same glass issue than Maxwell? How well does it handle interiors?

 

Fran has been knocking them out of the park with Fry lately. She mostly does interiors. But from the exteriors posted at Fry's forum, its obvious that the glass issue is Maxwell's only. Its not that its not solvable, its just not solvable by the geniuses at NextLimit.

 

However, forget all that. Fry is Windows only. They say they have no immediate plans for a MacOS version, and many people have asked.

 

I think their licences/CPU (vs. Maxwell) policy is better, too.

[Fran]

Hi Ernesto,

 

I am limited in what I can show of my current production, but here is a "novelty" shot from a larger scene. The Corbu chair is by Zuliban, not the most accurate, but it was perfect for the overall scene, where it was viewed from a distance.

 

[AJLynn]

Sweet.

[Aaron2004]

Before plunking down any more cash than necessary...at least check out the open sourced Indigo (Indigorenderer.com) It isn't TOO user friendly, but it's free...and still produces work up to par with Maxwell and the others.

 

I can't talk though...I abandoned it for VRAY.

 

 

Aaron

[Devin Johnston]

Fran what is the resolution of the final image you did and how long did it take to render on how many machines?

[Fran]

Hi Devin,

 

If you mean the chairs, the original res was 2400x1800 and it rendered over 1 dual dual-core xeon 2.0 for 7hr 51min.

 

The full scene (5250x3400 pixels) rendered over 2 dual dual-cores for about 18.5 hours (each machine).

[Adehus]

When Fry was first released, I thought that Maxwell had the edge on image quality. I don't think that's true anymore, though, and Fran's images are excellent examples of why this is no longer the case.

[Devin Johnston]

I wouldn’t say that there any "better" than Maxwell but it looks like there faster and that's a major plus for Fry.

[AJLynn]

What Fran is showing, if it's using the "real" lighting (not a studio setup with big light planes) looks like the kind of thing that would take several days in Maxwell at that resolution, if it renders at all. So I'd say Fry looks very promising on that basis.

[Devin Johnston]

At that resolution I can definitely say Maxwell can't touch Fry, I'm doing stuff at 3000x2250 using 10 dual core machines and after 15 hours I'm only getting to a SL of 16.21. Even after that I still have tons of noise which probably wouldn’t clear significantly until SL18 which would take at least 24+ hours. My comment though was just on image quality; even though it takes Maxwell 4 times longer the quality is about the same. Kind of makes you wonder why I'm even bothering to write this when it's so apparent that Maxwell is slow as molasses.

[Fran]

Hi guys,

 

The lighting consists of about 30 wall washing light fixtures - the actual models with an emitter material applied to the flo tubes, and 2 fairly large skylights. I did use Environment lighting rather than skylight in this case.

 

Devin, I know you've probably gone over everything with NL tech support - but the times you report are unusually slow.

[CHE]

Thanks for sharing that rendering with us Fran. It looks great! I don't think that I can even get Maxwell to render over 2400 pixels for a final rendering. Fryrender seems to be faster than Maxwell, at least faster enough to notice it. I owned a 3dsmax6 license would that be a problem with the plugin? If so, how many types of files can you import into the stand-alone aplication? What can you tell us about the stand-alone application? Have you use it for production? If so, how user friendly is it?

I just landed a big project and I am thinking about using Fryrender for it. I will need to render 6 to 8 interior renderings (a vestibule with a tall glass wall and skylights) and possibly an animation. Do you think that I would have any problems adjusting to Fryrender coming from a Maxwell background?

 

Ernesto

 

@Maxer: In case that I stick to Maxwell for this job. Are you still offering renderfarm services?

[Fran]

Thanks Ernesto.

 

The issue with output size is the amount of pixels that your ram will allow in the framebuffer. Fryrender vBeta 1.6 (the next release) can render to strips (up to 4 vertical or horizontal) or buckets (up to 16). So, that substantially increases the size of output you can render without having to page to the hard drive.

 

Fryrender is not a 3d application in the way that Maxwell Studio is. The goal is to have host plug-ins that fully control fryrender scene creation so that you remain in your area of expertise - your chosen 3d app. However it is possible to edit some features of the scene once it is open in the fryrender console application. I find it quite flexible. There is a plug-in for Max 6.

 

I hope I answered all your questions.

[Devin Johnston]

So can Fry do distributed rendering like Vray or Final Render, if so how many machines can you use?

[Adehus]

I wouldn’t say that there any "better" than Maxwell but it looks like there faster and that's a major plus for Fry.

 

Not better, not worse... just quicker... and in that respect, much better!

[Devin Johnston]

Ok you win

[Fran]

Devin, even though I sound like I know what I'm talking about, you would probably be better off asking about network stuff on the fryrender forum.

[CHE]

Thanks Fran. I just have two more questions. Does Fryrender supports particles? I know Ernest said that it is obvious that Fryrender has not issues regarding sun light through glass. Could you confirm that?