Please, advice!

[sdds]

Hey all, need a bit of advice.

 

Have been doing 3d for a few years now while doing other stuff like page layout, websites etc. I am trying to get a job in the vis line, and would settle for a bit of freelance as well. I have had some good feed back from some companies but no work and TBH getting a little frustrated.

 

I work in cinema 4d because I have a mac and maybe this is part of the prob, I don't have a pc or the cash to get set up with mac/vray etc. I have tried marketing myself by email and broachers, with little success. Anyway here is some of my work I do, maybe someone could give me some ideas and or some encouragement.

 

I live in the uk BTW.

 

Thanks guys

 

All images are done without gi/radiosity. :mad:

[sdds]

Someone must have some tips

[mahorela]

your work is on the right track no doubt......some grain creeping in but it looks pretty good. check out this website www.archiform3d.com a great company that uses c4d exclusively and is always looking for freelancers, you will however have to get your work up to the standards they are looking for.....which won't be easy. Other than that I would be researching the third party rendering options you have with c4d and try to make the very best of what you have got. Max and vray are by no means mandatory for this kind of work.

[louis.cho]

I don't have 'tips' since I am not specialist at all but I can tell you what I would you to look at.

 

try to get smooter result, too much grain on a image make it strange. You can also use more interresting materials, use glass, metal and wood.

[sdds]

Thanks guys, great site mahorela. Its encouraging to hear that max is not necessary. I have looked into 3d party render engines and know that vray will soon be available for C4d users.

 

I have seen some places use vray quite badly, it just goes to show that lighting takes skill and not necessarily great technology.

 

Will sort out the grain on the images, thats me adding it in post to hide imperfections.

[JamesTaylor]

personally i like the grain creeping, really softens the renders. makes a nice change from the ultra crisp computer perfect images we constantly see!

 

I think you'll find Max and Viz are the most widely used apps in the industry, however there are a good few that also use C4D. Your work is certainly to good standard so i'd suggest perservering with your search and continue sending out your portfolio and CV, i'm sure someone will interested even if they allow you to pick up max or viz along the way.

[sdds]

Thank you for your kind words jat10005,

 

Where in the UK do you hale from if you don't mind me asking?

 

I appreciate your engorgement I will keep looking and working away. I have stopped doing odd jobs, saved up some cash and now focusing on my future.

 

Looking back I think my lighting has come on leaps & bounds, now maybe need more work on texturing & modeling.

 

I have done page layout, web design etc but find it boring compared to 3d now, I don't really want to go back to it (a helpful skill though). I have had some interviews but the interviewers didn't understand what went into some of my images.

 

Example of what one chap said to me;

 

"So your portfolio is full of pretty pictures, so what you can do 3d. Get some real work in there like a broacher or something. I know a lot about 3d but don't do it anymore because it was boring. By the way did you airbrush this in photoshop?"

 

This guy was a prick and hadn't even bothered to read my CV, didn't look me in the eye or gave me any respect. I calk this up to good experience and managed to keep my cool.

[thinice]

I think your images are pretty competent.

 

I see that your model and lighting are accurate enough.

 

If you can do it fast enough, I don't think you would have any problem getting a job at an architectural or design practice.

[sdds]

Another day of calling&emailing, no luck. Can't get any freelance work ether.

 

Followed up my brochures with phone calls, most had binned them. Sorry to sound so doom and gloom, just frustrated.

 

How else could I get some freelance work besides the broacher & cold calling route. I will look more depth into the job section of this site.

 

Also I can get a still room set done in about 5 hours excluding the render time (roughly), is that a good speed?

[STRAT]

no problems with the quality of your work m8.

 

and dont worry about your system settup - my clients couldn't give a monkeys whether i use max, maya, c4d on a pc or a mac. my clients dont know these things and couldnt care less. why should they?

 

without wishing to divulge my own personal marketing techniques (hey, giving the enemy my secrets? ) i can say that i find that 2-3 well chosen images/collections of images on A4 photographic paper speaks volumns over a web site.

 

I made a website up last year for the first time (just for a change), and even though i was reasonably happy with it it didn't earn me a penny. so now i've discontinued my subscription. (as you can see by my website link )

 

In recent years i get all my work in through reputation alone (not wishing to sound big-headed, just stating a fact) so i dont market much any more. but, as mentioned, a properly worded short letter (a c.v. and life history certainly isnt needed) and 2-3 glossy pages of your best imagery works better and gets noticed better than a flashy web site, which doesn't do your work the justice anyway.

 

and research the companys you're targeting - dont just title your letter 'dear sir' but find out the name of the person concerned. then give them a ring in a few days and speak to him/her direct asking to set a meeting for you to come in to see them. they're only going to say no.

 

i do store imagery and anims online incase they need to be viewed remotely, but i've hardly ever needed to call on them.

 

your luck will obviously vary from town to town and seasons in the year. persistance.

 

But, sounds like you've possibly tried this type of technique out before. dont worry, things do happen, just maybe not instantly.

 

good luck!

 

 

 

Also I can get a still room set done in about 5 hours excluding the render time (roughly), is that a good speed?

 

how long is a peice of string? how big and detailed is the room? dont worry about trying to model/render as fast as The Stig, it doesn't matter. 5 hours is good, but irrelevant. the next chap might do it in 10 hours but be twice as good. i know what the client would prefer. tight timings measured in hours are more usual for employees rather than freelancers.

oh, i'd certainly advise you learn proper gi and radiosity too.

[znotlin]

Simon...I think that the images are pretty terriffic in that you definitely have a painter's eye. Noise, no noise, GI, no GI clients don't care as long as the images are good - and what impresses me tremendously is the handling of the bedspread in the first image, with the choice of paintings you have on the wall. It may have been happenstance, but it seems to me that in making the bedspread not so realistic - you also went for Georgia O'Keefe type paintings that have a similar kind of abstraction. Well done and a rare sensitivity.

 

What isn't so well done is the architectural detailing (door handle too far away from edge of door, weird columns, music stands? etc..) and my own sense is that since most architects gravitate to that stuff over issues of art you're not meeting with much success.

 

So while it may seem miserable to contemplate, if you have saved up some money - I think most large success stories within architectural illustration start by offering to do an interesting job for next to nothing or free. It is a two edged sword - free means that people may not treat you with respect and force you to make images that suck - or you can offer to do something for free making clear that in exchange for that they give you more creative control. Then you parlay that job, which should ultimately take on much more life than your own images because of the rigorous architectural detailing into a marketing campaign.

 

So find a well respected local avant garde architect, (THE PROJECT MUST BE REMARKABLE EITHER IN TERMS OF SCALE, ARCHITECTURAL INVENTION, CLIENT, OR PROGRAM - SO DON'T DO A CRAPPY HOUSE) tell them you would like the opportunity to work with them on a project in order to develop some portfolio paintings. And in exchange they will get some nice renderings of their project.

 

You'll get there, I do think you have something special you just need to get the opportunity.

[3D_IC]

I like the style of your images. You have a good eye for detail.

 

It can be a hard slog getting through to the right people.

I would suggest a few tips if you haven't done them already.

 

Select 3-4 of you very best images. Show them to anyone who isn't in 3d and ask them what they think. You will be surprised what the lay person will pick out. Change these aspects of your image if you think they are relevant.

 

print out the images on a4 glossy with you name etc on. Wtrite a cover letter explaining your situation. Don't sound desperate, and not too over confidant. Print out your CV (one to two pages)

 

sent thse addressed to the director (find out who the director is) of the company you choose. Never just send to the company because the secretary may bin it.

 

Another way is to call and ask if you can arrange a meeting to show your portfolio. If you do get a meeting make sure you have your very best work printed on the best paper. I like A2 size so the client/boss can see everything without squinting. Its good to show some wireframe to grey to colour to photoshop stuff so they can see how you do it without you trying to explein.

 

most importantly when you get knocked down, get back up and try again. Persistance pays dividends.

 

Just a few tips from my experience. Hope i was of some help.

[Tommy L]

 

So while it may seem miserable to contemplate, if you have saved up some money - I think most large success stories within architectural illustration start by offering to do an interesting job for next to nothing or free. It is a two edged sword - free means that people may not treat you with respect and force you to make images that suck - or you can offer to do something for free making clear that in exchange for that they give you more creative control. Then you parlay that job, which should ultimately take on much more life than your own images because of the rigorous architectural detailing into a marketing campaign.

 

So find a well respected local avant garde architect, (THE PROJECT MUST BE REMARKABLE EITHER IN TERMS OF SCALE, ARCHITECTURAL INVENTION, CLIENT, OR PROGRAM - SO DON'T DO A CRAPPY HOUSE) tell them you would like the opportunity to work with them on a project in order to develop some portfolio paintings. And in exchange they will get some nice renderings of their project.

 

You'll get there, I do think you have something special you just need to get the opportunity.

 

Im afraid I disagree with Znotlin, I think doing free stuff for a client is a waste of time, that time would be better spent networking or learning. The client you give something free to will never value your work in the future, in a way youve lost a client before youve got him.

 

the advice from 3d__ic is very good, bear in mind, you only need one or two regular clients.

[znotlin]

And yet...most great illustrators have done that at the start of their career so they can brand their own look and not be beholden to their client who will drive the aesthetic.

 

If you're doing photorealism the same as everyone else I would agree with you, but from what I see, this artist sees things differently so I think he has some real possibilities in pushing his own style - and he won't if an architect or developer is beating him up because they're paying him and feel like they can/should.

 

If he can develop his style however and make that a marketable entity than he stands to gain much more in the long run.

[Tommy L]

And yet...most great illustrators have done that at the start of their career so they can brand their own look and not be beholden to their client who will drive the aesthetic.

 

If you're doing photorealism the same as everyone else I would agree with you, but from what I see, this artist sees things differently so I think he has some real possibilities in pushing his own style - and he won't if an architect or developer is beating him up because they're paying him and feel like they can/should.

 

If he can develop his style however and make that a marketable entity than he stands to gain much more in the long run.

 

For those who can afford it...great,

for the rest of us.......its a client led business. The client can have whatever he/she wants. If you have your own style, I agree, clients will come to you because they like and want to utilize that style. But you develop a style over years, not weeks or months. And you need to have an intuitive grasp of the tools before you develop a style. Until then, a style is 'accidental'.

This guy needs a couple of clients, not a concept.

[znotlin]

And you need to have an intuitive grasp of the tools before you develop a style. Until then, a style is 'accidental'.

This guy needs a couple of clients, not a concept.

 

I think he's closer to a style than you give him credit for, and clearly more apt to experiment with color than most.

 

But I don't think he is gonna get sufficiently paying clients until he has some stronger architecture in the portfolio - and if I had money saved as he says he does, I'd much rather do a killer image that I had complete control of (aka free), than one that I had to lowball to get, and then got beaten over the head on the aesthetic too. At this stage of his career he's not likely to make any real money either way.

 

That way at least I have something to market with. It is a marketing strategy, and if that's a concept so be it.

[thinice]

I thought you were talking about getting a job.

 

Freelance is a business, and you cannot build it overnight.

 

First, I agree with znotlin that you need some stronger architectural stuff in your portfolio. You need at least a couple of exterior of medium to large scale development. Forget houses, go for shopping complex, institutional buildings etc. Just find some arch drawings and work on it. The reason is that, these are the type renderings where there are budget allocated to it.

 

For interiors and the like, there are many instances where architects have to pay from their own pocket and very reluctant to engage somebody they are not familiar with.

 

Secondly, get a client. Do whatever it takes but you need to start with one client. You can even offer to do free work for charities or the like that will help expose you to potential clients. I have no problem with doing work for free - as long as know what you are getting out of it.

 

Being a freelance is a different ball game than working for someone else. Probably you should think about getting some experience in an architect's office before going freelance.

[rotten42]

Thank you for your kind words jat10005,

 

Where in the UK do you hale from if you don't mind me asking?

 

I appreciate your engorgement I will keep looking and working away. I have stopped doing odd jobs, saved up some cash and now focusing on my future.

 

Looking back I think my lighting has come on leaps & bounds, now maybe need more work on texturing & modeling.

 

I have done page layout, web design etc but find it boring compared to 3d now, I don't really want to go back to it (a helpful skill though). I have had some interviews but the interviewers didn't understand what went into some of my images.

 

Example of what one chap said to me;

 

"So your portfolio is full of pretty pictures, so what you can do 3d. Get some real work in there like a broacher or something. I know a lot about 3d but don't do it anymore because it was boring. By the way did you airbrush this in photoshop?"

 

This guy was a prick and hadn't even bothered to read my CV, didn't look me in the eye or gave me any respect. I calk this up to good experience and managed to keep my cool.

 

 

keep plugging. I'm trying to find the time to upgrade into Max/vray but in the meantime I still use Lightscape. I don't do any advertising. I just keep networking. That's how I've developed my client base. It started slowly but has grown quite well. Last year I did 93 renders.