Jeff Mottle Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 I'm curious, what do you guys do when you have an indecisive client, who keep making changes, but when asked what they want, won't take the time to tell you? They seem to have plenty of time to critique the work, but no time to answer questions when they come up. It's fine I guess because we just keep increasing the bill, but bad becuase it is dragging on forever. I have other projects to do and would really like to move on. Has anybody else run into this? What did you do? [ June 03, 2002, 11:15 AM: Message edited by: Jeff Mottle ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3danim8d Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 Jeff, Have you approached the client with interim billing or are you only billing at completion of the project? Did you take a percentage of the bill up front? How long has the project gone on, compared to how much time was estimated/originally discussed when the project was initiated? Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Mottle Posted June 3, 2002 Author Share Posted June 3, 2002 Have you approached the client with interim billing or are you only billing at completion of the project? Oh they know about what it will cost them. I'm pretty good at letting them what is and is not in the original scope, read cost. Did you take a percentage of the bill up front? Yes, don't work unless I have 50% up front and 50% on delivery. How long has the project gone on, compared to how much time was estimated/originally discussed when the project was initiated? Well we estimated three weeks, but I think we are on like week 6 or 7. The "upcharges" prevent the client from getting to out of control, but I would just like it if they just told us what they want and let us do it, rather than saying do whatever you like and "fake it" then tell us that it isn't right. Despite spelling all of this out in a conttact to the nth degree, they still drag it out. I don't think it helps that the actual end client is not who I deal with. I deal with the ad agency. The agency is great and knows what is going on, but it he client who is out to lunch. [ June 03, 2002, 12:30 PM: Message edited by: Jeff Mottle ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quizzy Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 Let them know that you will continue the job in a couple of weeks, and begin the other job. bring it to them gently... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nisus Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 Hi Jeff, We've had these kind of problems too. It's great to see that you covered yourself in with a payment up front and with the extra work being paid, but you can't really do much against an indecisive client. The only thing you can do is to give them a deadline: last changes has to be briefed before this or that date OR we will start the final rendering at this day. Any changes after this date will not be excepted. Sounds a bit hard, but it's the only way to move forward, because afterall you'll probably have another contract going on that has to be finished right on time. So just choose you're delivery day rgds nisus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 Jeff, we run into this problem all the time! We have a pretty big shop so we're able to shuffle things around to accommodate most clients. Another thing that we've started doing in addition to a 50/50 payment plan is switching over to an hourly contract once we hit the estimated hours for the original contract. This works well with clients that try to noodle you to death. It sucks to work on a project for an eternity but at least you can make some decent money. Also, let them know that they're not your only client and that you can only allocate x percentage of your time due to the change in scope of your project. rod Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Mottle Posted June 3, 2002 Author Share Posted June 3, 2002 Thanks guys, Well sounds like I'm pretty much on track then. I've already told them that they are about to run out of "free" minutes and will be billed hourly past the flat rate estimate we came up with. I guess just have to give it a few days to see if the dust settles then give them the "news" Thanks again, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nisus Posted June 4, 2002 Share Posted June 4, 2002 Hi all, I have to agree with rod. Change to an hourly rate for all the changes or details that are not in the original contract. That is why it is a good idea - like I mentioned before somewhere on this board - to give the client a good idea of what he can expect and an even better one on the things NOT included in your contract. That way you're sure to get paid for every hour you work. It may sound greedy, but you'll never know where it stops otherwise. A client has to know that one can't buy a huge car while only spending a budget for a small car! rgds nisus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Posted June 6, 2002 Share Posted June 6, 2002 i have found that giving your client a passworded link to a webpage, with all the latest images on them, helps a lot. instead of getting together once or twice a week to review changes, my clients can check out the latest renders that i upload a couple of times a day, and let me know straight away if i am going down the wrong path modeling their project. i have had numerous times, where a client has rung me up, to advise me that i had modeled something wrong, and it saved me a lot of time in changes, because i was able to adjust early in the modeling process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Mottle Posted June 7, 2002 Author Share Posted June 7, 2002 Hey Wolf, That's a really good idea. Unfourtunatly this client can't even be bothered to answer major questions about the project, much less actually open a browser and enter in a password. We've been in hiatis for the past 1.5 weeks now waiting for them to make a decision. Next week, I'm drawing a line in the sand and putting an end to all of this. I find it funny how it's such an emergency rush rendering, but when it comes rigth down to it, there was never a rush. It's like that here at work all the time. Frustrating when you are trying to schedule projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nisus Posted June 7, 2002 Share Posted June 7, 2002 Hi Wolf, Very nice idea, but how do you do it practically?Do you send them an url for every image you upload? Or do you link to an FTP server? Anything else? rgds nisus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DelfoZ Posted June 10, 2002 Share Posted June 10, 2002 first Scuse my english .. 1 weeks making the model, 5 days making the ambient (light,materials,plugins,etc,etc ).. Work Done . The client see the picture and say " i dont like the Sun light i prefer a night view, and chenge te cars and peoples, and change the trees for anothers more littles.. " maybe we can do the changes in 2 days . we can avouit that having better comunication whit the clients , Maybe dont making a homepage with pass. just sending a previews Images via email. maybe one " the Model " .. and wait for the answer, if the model r ok, then Put Cars, poeple, etc etc, Next email, send that. wait for answer.. and finish the Work in the time .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nisus Posted June 10, 2002 Share Posted June 10, 2002 Hi all, I think Delfoz got a good point. Just make sure that you set some crucial deciding points during the production time, i.e. make sure the models don't change after day A, setup lighting next and be sure it won't change after day B etc. Move on gradually and be sure you don't have to do things over that were okay before.Keep track of these decissions because they can help you afterwards when a client thinks those changes were included. rgds nisus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Griger Posted June 10, 2002 Share Posted June 10, 2002 Everything is by the hour here in my office, including a retainer. If you can stick to your decisions, then you'll get a great product at a competitive price. If you can’t make up your mind, then your one of my best customers and putting gravy on my potatoes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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