Onyx tree library

[skeay]

Hello,

 

I've been looking at onyx as an alternative to rpcs, we use these at the moment & I gotta admit I'm not a great fan.

Trouble is they have a pretty extensive library, (I work at a landscape architect's so tree variety is pretty important) - to pursuade my seniors I need an alternative which has a good library too.

 

So my question, onyx has a pretty good base library but do they have any extended libraries?

 

edit: example we have a project which uses sweetgum trees (Liquidambar styraciflua) which so how would I get a template for this or would I need to model it?

 

 

Many thanks,

Simon

Edited November 12, 2009 by skeay
re phrase question

[WAcky]

I don't know if you have a list of the presets it ships with but aside from that, whats on the onyx site nursery and a few more here you'll have to make them yourself. Not too hard once you've done a few but the learning curb is very steep. An alternative to Onyx which seems to be the next most popular one is Xfrog but unlike onyx you have to buy libraries of trees.

[TheAllusionisst]

You can download a pretty comprehensive library of xFrog trees converted to Max already here:

 

http://seek.autodesk.com/search.htm#query=search^new^query%3Dxfrog%3Bsource%3DQuickLinks

 

Not exactly what you were looking for, but a good start for your library.

 

Well that link didn't seem to work, just go to the seek site and in the list there is a "new" icon next to 'Trees', select the trees and it will take you there.

 

http://seek.autodesk.com

Edited November 12, 2009 by Russell L. Thomas

[skeay]

thanks for the replies, I'm looking into it. Does xfrog work with max, I found some threads saying it was discontinued?

[TheAllusionisst]

thanks for the replies, I'm looking into it. Does xfrog work with max, I found some threads saying it was discontinued?

 

I don't know of any recent versions of the plugin, so you need to export out in xFrog via 3ds or obj.

 

The models in the link I provided are already Max files.

[jkletzien]

I think the standard ONYX library is actually pretty awful, (trees are too small, leaves are overscaled) but I think a large part of that is that it was done 10 years ago when the computing power, proxies, etc, weren't what they are now and face count was the primary concern.

 

so, you kinda have to do your own, but that is OK because the program is easy to get results from quickly (even if getting really good at it takes ages) and it allows you to adjust leaf count/opacity, limb up, develop variations of a specimen, etc, which you'll have a much harder time doing with a fixed library.

 

So while developing your own library is daunting, and your bosses major investment will be your time not Onyx, but you'll have so much more flexibility than either RPC's (yikes), or fixed model libraries IMHO it's probably worth it.

[RevitGary]

If you work for a landscape architect. I dont think there is a better product than onyx. I dont know of a more extensive library or the ability to customize them in any other product. Mental ray or V ray is a must when using onyx, so you can make proxy objects. Well maybe not a must, but a good idea if you are placing many trees in one scene.

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

I think the standard ONYX library is actually pretty awful, (trees are too small, leaves are overscaled) but I think a large part of that is that it was done 10 years ago when the computing power, proxies, etc, weren't what they are now and face count was the primary concern.

 

so, you kinda have to do your own, but that is OK because the program is easy to get results from quickly (even if getting really good at it takes ages) and it allows you to adjust leaf count/opacity, limb up, develop variations of a specimen, etc, which you'll have a much harder time doing with a fixed library.

 

So while developing your own library is daunting, and your bosses major investment will be your time not Onyx, but you'll have so much more flexibility than either RPC's (yikes), or fixed model libraries IMHO it's probably worth it.

 

Quoted for agreement. I typically use Onyx for aerials, casting shadows, and NPR work. At least when it comes to trees, bushes require a lot more comping time, so you might be better developing nice 3d solutions.

 

A good 2d tree library and a skilled hand at comping, color balance, and adjusting light on the tree will typically look better and be aster than 3d. At least in my opinion.

 

As for RPC trees... I use the high res ones a lot. They are actually quite nice, but you need to use them with through Photoshop, not through your 3d application.

 

Jon... Out of curiosity, what is your favorite 3d tree creation app right now?

Edited December 8, 2009 by Crazy Homeless Guy

[jkletzien]

it is onyx...we've just been using it so long.

 

that said, Onyx clearly has its limitations (branch topology, large sizes, counter curving branches, etc..), so we bought the exlevel plugin a year ago which looks pretty good, but no one in the office has had the time to learn it to the level we know Onyx.

[carlotristan3d]

i'm recommending my company to purhase onyx too, but i'm worried about rendering time. (my boss is one who likes to sit beside you and expect results immediately), of course it'll depend on how we populate the scene, but just an example, a typical house render would probably take 2 hrs. if i include a single aec tree it'll render in 2 1/2. i'm wondering how onyx trees contribute to render time.

[RevitGary]

Use them as proxies and they are reasonable. Do you use mental ray?

 

If you can DONT use opacity maps and custom leaves. That will increase render time.

 

If you need to use opacity maps I saw a site , I think Zaps, That says to make the final gather map without opacity maps then do the final render with opacity maps. This trick will greatly decrease render times.

[RevitGary]

I just did a quick test. I have a really good computer.

I did 1/4 - 4 aa and 3 bounces FG.

 

With no trees 5 minutes.

 

With a boat load of trees and bushes and the ground completely covered with grass 11 minutes. ( see attachment ) I have 4 different kinds of bushes and 2 different kinds of trees

 

You can always tell you boss if time is such a concern a new computer will pay for itself. Seriously if you are doing a lot of 3D modeling it is worth it.

 

You can always try and find other ways to speed up your renderings.

Its always a trade off.

[carlotristan3d]

thanks gary. i suppose if it cuts down on post work it'll be worth it. 5 min to 11 min, if it increases exponentially as you increase your output then onyx doubles up the rendering time. more coffee break for me.

[TheAllusionisst]

Faster rendering trees in Max using mental ray:

 

http://www.mrmaterials.com/jeffs-blog/103-faster-foliage-renders.html

[RevitGary]

You can always set things up during the day then batch render several images over night.

 

I used very low setting for the test I showed you. I am sure for real renderings with proper DPI and GI will be more like 2 hours each.