EXR with burned gamma?

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

Does anyone know if there is a way to save to EXR without it being a floating point image? I tired the Integer (32 bits/Channel) but that didn’t read correctly in Photoshop.

 

EXR’s seem to offer the best compression for 16bit, but often I would rather burn whatever gamma I am working at directly into the image. I know I can use the OpenEXR plug-in and specify the gamma on import, but I would rather just burn it in and use the EXR format.

[alias_marks]

Don't know if this is what your looking for... I generally do a gamma override in the save dialog box when saving exr's and set it to 1.0. Then when I open in photoshop or after effects it looks the same as in max.

 

Edit: Scratch that... I see your wanting to save with non floating point.

 

Are you just trying to save time so you don't have to convert from 32 - 16 bit in photoshop all the time?

 

If so I'd be curious if there's a solution out there too.

Edited October 7, 2010 by alias_marks

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

Yeah... I typically work with everything visible in the base rendering, and clamp/sub-pixel colors for nice AA around highlights and bright spots. So in theory I really don't need a lot of colors beyond 0.0 or 1.0. Therefore floating point isn't a big concern for myself.

 

But I do work in 16bit color and need the extra color depth for my adjustments, levels, and curves. EXR is the most effeiceint file format in terms of disk size and information stored, so it is the format I would like to work with.

 

I don't have a problem when I am working at gamma 1.0 or gamma 2.2, but occasionally I am working at gamma 1.6 or gamma 1.8. It all depends on how the scene was setup, and what look I am trying to achieve. When I am working with these gammas I typically wind up saving as a 16bit TIFF so that the gamma is burned in. This works fine, but the file size on disk is often double what it is as a EXR, and when you are rendering a lot this could be a couple extra gigs of information you are pushing around the server.

 

EXR doesn't seem to like anything besides gamma 1.0 or gamma 2.2. When working with anything else it requires extra steps to get an exact match between Max and Photoshop, and it becomes really difficult when going between Max and AfterEffects.

 

Unless I am missing something that is obvious...

[alias_marks]

I'm completely with ya on exr being the best in show these days for file formats.

 

I'm not 100% sure if this is an accurate way to do it, and haven't tested it thoroughly... but when I stray away from the 1.0 and 2.2 gammas I'll keep everything set up as normal 2.2 gamma linear workflow, and only tweak the gamma in the color mapping vray roll out. and then when I go to save, I still use the 1.0 override and it seems to match well enough for my needs.

 

I think that's a valid point to just work with images that don't require floating point and crunch your images so they just look right out of the render.

 

It kind of makes me think of another point that's a little off topic, but what the heck. Until recently, I've been of the mindset that I've always wanted ultimate flexibility at every stage of every image, even if that included being able to adjust 32-bit exposure whenever I wanted. Recently I've started to grow a liking to try and restrict flexibility a bit to force decision making, which it sounds like your doing by keeping the raw render between 0-1.0 color from the start.

 

I recently ran across a face book post by one of the guys at MIR that I enjoyed that touches on the topic.

 

"Since 20 years ago everything is more fragmented anyway. Even if people say that they are "process oriented", the modern design-process looks like many small processes starting and stopping simultaneous...ly. It's like: "everything is possible and you can get everywhere at any point in the process, so whats the point in continuing here if its better over there?". Like a music video or speed dating.

 

Take a look at how professionals work in photoshop; adjustment layers and selection sets make it possible to go back and change everything at every stage in the process.

 

We try to work more like a painter would, avoiding too many adjustment layers and masks where possible because they nourish a state where you ultimately don't believe in the choices you make. You postphone decisions. We would rather get into a state of mind where you get this old school flow and then the image just ripens in one direction rather than keeping all possibilities open."

 

http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/MIR/208381847432

[Justin Hunt]

There is something to what they are saying, but I feel it all falls down when it comes to makeing updates.

 

One of the glories of adjustment layers is that often all it takes to update the final image is to swap out the base render layer. With what they are suggesting if you have to update the final image you have to re-do the entire (or parts) post process, and becomes a bigger head-ache what you are working on an old image and you cant remeamber what settings/adjustments you did in the first place.

 

jhv

[aaronrumple]

In vray you can brun it in pretty easily. There are two settings in conjunction with the frame buffer related to this. In the Color Mapping dialog, select "Don't affect colors (adaptation only). With this checked - you would then enable the sRGB button in the frame buffer. This will then reflect your gamma settings of 1.6, 1.8 or 2.2 from both 3DS Max and Vray. The max rendering window will also look correct with the final gamma as it will be seen when opened in PS.

 

Alternately, you don't select the "Don't affect colors" option and don't select the sRGB button in teh frame buffer to not have the gamma burned in on the exr.

 

For our current annimation, we burned in the gamma so there would be less post work to do and not as much to go wrong between the exr and After Effects.

[Crazy Homeless Guy]

With this checked - you would then enable the sRGB button in the frame buffer. This will then reflect your gamma settings of 1.6, 1.8 or 2.2 from both 3DS Max and Vray. The max rendering window will also look correct with the final gamma as it will be seen when opened in PS.

 

I haven't been able to get this to work. I think it has to do with the enabling of the sRGB button, which cranks the gamma past 1.8 since sRGB by definition uses a gamma of 2.2.

 

Maybe I am missing something or my workflow is different, my image appear washed out.

 

I recently ran across a face book post by one of the guys at MIR that I enjoyed that touches on the topic.

 

I agree with a lot of this, and have had it in the back of my mind since you posted it. It would be fun to go back and try a hand painted rendering.

 

One of the glories of adjustment layers is that often all it takes to update the final image is to swap out the base render layer. With what they are suggesting if you have to update the final image you have to re-do the entire (or parts) post process, and becomes a bigger head-ache what you are working on an old image and you cant remeamber what settings/adjustments you did in the first place.

 

I agree. Adjustment layers are a valid part of the process. To the point that I might even refer to myself as an adjustment layer whore. Well, at time anyway.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Crazy Homeless Guy