heni30 Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 (edited) The client I work for did an airport RFP (big competition for new stores and shops) in Atlanta last year. It was the biggest expansion ever and we had to do 42 renderings. After it was over, someone sent these over that were done by one of our competitors. I'm pretty sure they were done overseas. Aside from the overly starched table clothes I was pretty impressed. The interior angle is kinda weird especially with that girl in red right in the middle. What do y'all think? Pics above are larger - can't seem to delete the thumbnails Edited July 26, 2012 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 i think the renders are OK for standard descriptive type stuff however the people are horrendous...just slapped in from some generic library. total rubbish. -11110000000 / 10 not that hard to take people in correct light tbh - and less is more in interior spaces (unless you can pull off a convincing crowd!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted July 26, 2012 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 (edited) Airport shop/restaurant proposal renderings are VERY undemanding. You would be appalled at the quality of some of the things that get submitted. I would guess a budget of $1000 for the exterior view - plus half price for the second view for these. Vyonyx starts at $3000 usd for a simple view - complex view goes for $4500 usd. Believe me, correctly lit people was not a top priority. Edited July 26, 2012 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 yikes well you get what you pay for who are complex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted July 26, 2012 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 I would imagine #2 would be simple and #4 is complex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 oopss sorry i read 'complex' to be a different studio charging 4500! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted July 26, 2012 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 (edited) I changed it to read complex view. Hey, do you think you're going to get that fan blur in #2 for free? I also put in a larger jpg of the exterior in the OP. Edited July 26, 2012 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario De Achadinha Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 They ok, people look out of place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchrender Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Thats crazy money is the current climate, and if clients are paying that they are looking around. Sorry way too much. Phil Airport shop/restaurant proposal renderings are VERY undemanding. You would be appalled at the quality of some of the things that get submitted. I would guess a budget of $1000 for the exterior view - plus half price for the second for view for these. Vyonyx starts at $3000 usd for a simple view - complex view goes for $4500 usd. Believe me, correctly lit people was not a top priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alekzab Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Well, the interior looks OK/Good. But the people look out of place and are in full sunlight inside of the space. The woman in the red dress looks like shes walking at 2-3MPH inside of the circulation space. Overall Is good, but the people is what needs a tad of work. Nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain Denby Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 I think these look a little bit like the work of our friend on here - Tim Nelson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted July 26, 2012 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 (edited) I think these look a little bit like the work of our friend on here - Tim Nelson. Hi Iain, I agree - very similar tonal palette but I don't think he would have a mish mash of people like those in the interior. Edited July 26, 2012 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M V Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 Agreed. If I quoted a client $3k they would just go find someone cheaper because cheaper exists (refer to top of this posting). Vyonyx is great, don't get me wrong. They (and all of us) deserve these prices, but clients these days don't even want to spend on renders and think they don't need them most of the time. If I sent a proposal for $3,000 for one exterior, they would never email me back. Thats crazy money is the current climate, and if clients are paying that they are looking around. Sorry way too much. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dollus Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 I really don't think these are Tim's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Moir Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Thats crazy money is the current climate, and if clients are paying that they are looking around. Sorry way too much. Phil Yet Vyonyx are busier than ever, Phil. I think you have to take into account the type of client / project they produce work for. In any case, Vyonyx have a clearly defined pricing structure, so not all their work is charged at their top rate (as I understand it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted July 27, 2012 Author Share Posted July 27, 2012 (edited) This (Vyonyx) is clearly a case of producing a product that is so unique and high quality that you are able to charge a premium. Their images are like Hollywood matte paintings - definitely in the realm of fine art. And so audacious! Who else would have the cojones to disregard color and use an almost sepia palette and have light so blinding that it almost washes out the image. But when you are "Hot" and the happening thing, clients are more likely to give in to your artistic and financial demands. Edited July 27, 2012 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pailhead Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) The people in both images are surprisingly well placed. With the exception of the woman in red. Even she is in great perspective, but just doesnt make a lot of sense in that position. The lighting of the people definitely knock it down by a few notches. The renderings themselves are maybe above average... typical in-house, archtectural, "we just need to show the space" + 1. The people in a sense help them a lot, and i'm a bit confused. I think it was a tedious task to put all these people into correct scale and perspective (and they seem pretty fine here) and then leave them like that. Even without painting over them, just a simple adjustment would do it wonders. The first image has pretty good materials. People adjusted, and some artistic touches, and it would be quite impressive. Just fixing the people alone and it would be a really good architectural rendering. The second one, it could probably use some life on top of these things. I'd place less people, but way more strategic, some drinks on the counters, people in the booth actually having a dinner etc. Just adjusting the people, and removing a few while leaving some as is, would make it a decent rendering. 2nd one is really suffering from the people, the first one isn't even so bad. As for vyonyx image (you should describe what you're showing, i'm not sure what i'm looking at) #2 is not a $3000 rendering IMHO. I think it's a $1000 tops, if you're lucky enough to get paid for your work as you really should, but more likely $400-$500 under the current circumstances. I'm sure there are people over the dreaded seas that would do it for $150-$200. The only way i see this being way over $1000 is if every single item in it was custom modeled, and you have a really good reputation and steady clients.. It would still be expensive, but i can see how it could happen, because you're basically buying a cheap product, but other factors that constitute the whole service could justify the price. But even with all the custom modeling, i dont think it should raise the price much since it's all very simple in this particular image The other 3 images in the collage are pretty good to impressive. The last one is really good, and definitely worth at least a couple of thousand. I figure $1500 would be the bottom if it was done by a talented freelance illustrator who can probably pull this off with ease but doesn't get a lot of work. Done by a studio that's charging properly and has good clients, $2000-$3000 easily. More than that, i think you would really paying a premium, which may be a bit too much. I think that work like this still commands a price because most of the people in the 3rd world come from an architectural background and are self taught. I don't think that there are a lot of people with a full artistic education that go into 3d, and if they do it's always VFX. I'm talking from my experience with one such country In the US, a commercial architectural illustrator is an entity that has existed for decades, while i think it's quite a commodity in poorer countries. 3d made illustrations way more accessible. I think that a person who is capable of painting the last image, will have a much easier time doing all of this in 3d and photoshop, than the rest of us who don't have that kind of training. I still find myself experimenting a lot and doubting my choices when it comes to composition and sometimes lighting. Edited July 28, 2012 by pailhead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pailhead Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 [ATTACH=CONFIG]47828[/ATTACH] Hi Iain, I agree - very similar tonal palette but I don't think he would have a mish mash of people like those in the interior. Whos image is this? This one's worse than the restaurant, but i can't really tell why. Again the people are in great perspective, and again if they were integrated better it would make it a decent rendering. The space is not impressive, thus i don't think the rendering could ever become either. Way more life is needed, but i'm not sure what would be fitting since airport cafes are usually very clean and somewhat minimalistic, the tables are clean, and empty, most the time. Not sure how many happy hour chalkboards hang in places like this etc. Some obvious mistakes are the over exposure on the floor, the ugly and strong highlights on the table in the very foreground, but i don't think that this alone would take this image very far... You have to have in mind that this things are usually done under tight time constraints, and people nowadays are on a budget. If you went crazy with artistic touches on an image like this, you would either burn through a lot of hours, a lot of the clients money, and there's a good chance of doing something wrong as it's really hard to know what the client expects. Fixing the lighting for example, may make something appear not as white to a client, while a simple 90s scanline rendering makes him really happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alejandrovalentin Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Hi George!!! are you telling me that they charge $3000 for a single image wow!!!! i charge like 60usd and I think i am not that bad, ummmm I wish i have more clients that can paid me more.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielsouthgate1 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Philip, It very much depends where you are.. There has never been much of a budget in this industry or creative industries in general in Ireland. The States is very different and the prices have been quartered by what they used to be by good firms doing good work. The standard is generally a lot higher. I've returned to Ireland after working in London and New York for 12 years and the quality in Ireland is just not there yet so of course clients won't pay much..3k isn't crazy considering what used to be asked for in the arch viz industry. In regards to the images posted here, I definitely wouldn't have asked "are you impressed by these?" unless you are posting up really good work.. Maybe a subject like "Need advice how to improve my renderings" would be more appropriate. Thats crazy money is the current climate, and if clients are paying that they are looking around. Sorry way too much. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Fantucchio Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 $60, does that even cover the electricity to power your computer? Let alone eat food. The above renderings work well and do the job. As for 3k/image. That's a fair price coming from VONYX who are leaders in our industry. Developers rather than most architecture firms would have the deeper pockets to foot that kind of bill, and they would definitely need those sorts of images. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pailhead Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 $60 can feed a whole family in some parts of the world. $60 is also good pocket money when you live with your parents and they pay your bills.... i can totally understand someone charging that, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jez EMIN Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 (edited) Presumably $60 also factors in the costs of all the expensive AutoDesk 3D software.... Edited July 30, 2012 by JezEMIN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris MacDonald Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Presumably $60 also factors in the costs of all the expensive 3D software.... Maddening, isn't it? You spend hundreds (even thousands) on kitting yourself out with the right software for the job and some kid with all the same stuff but pirated undercuts your bid by a factor of 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jez EMIN Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Id been out of the 3D world for toooooo long a time - having only gotten back into it recently simply because I love creating renders again. Seems though that those AutoDesk threats many years ago re piracy were really to punish their real customers - they seem to do nowt about these days..... I guess that's their idea of Customer Care... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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