2x Xeon E5-2603

[bertjow1]

Hi all.

I'm going to buy new hardware for rendering in V-ray.

 

How about 2x Xeon E5-2603 I think it is good configuration because version 2xxx can be combined in dual mode. Unfortunately, I have not followed the development of the processor so I do not know how good this version of Xeon is.... for sure it is one of the cheapest version of it with posibility of connecting in dual mode.

 

Also, I have a question that you recommend to the board of processors.

 

 

best regards

[Dimitris Tolios]

Important questions:

 

1) What do I want to accomblish with my workstation/render node/PC?

2) Which is the budget I can operate in?

 

 

The E5-2603 is the most basic Xeon LGA2011 as you've figured out yourself. Yes, you can do dual CPU systems based on this CPUs, the question is "why?" .

 

It's basic price tag is there simply because this is a very basic, 1.8GHz quad core CPU: no-hyper-threading, no turboboost, virtually no overclocking potential, slow DDR3 1066 Ram controller.

 

Any i5 2500K/3570K system, will smoke it in single threaded applications, and likely will almost match 2x E5-2603 when Rendering. Yes, the i5 is a Quad also, but has double the base clock and it can turboboost one or more of its cores a shy off 4GHz. An i7-2600K/2700K/3770K, having hyperthreading will actually have 8 threads running at double the speed of the 8 threads the dual Xeon system you are suggesting purchasing - guess how the speed scale will lean...

 

Probably an AMD FX8120 system (CPU+Mobo) that can be put together for 75% of the cost of the 2x Xeon CPUs, will also be much faster in overall.

 

E5-2603 Pros :

• More Cache - which unfortunately won't do much for the applications you intent to use.
  
• ECC Ram Support - which again is not critical for most of us
  
• Quad Channel RAM - which can be matched almost by dual channel RAM running much faster or greatly outpaced by Quad Channel RAM offered by i7 LGA 2011 systems
  
• Can support lots of RAM - in case 32GB of LGA1155 and 64GB for LGA 2011 SB-E is not enough
  
• It is a Xeon so you get a less common sticker to brag about

 

Cons

• Initial investment much higher than a single i7 4C/8T, matching or surpassing the money needed for a LGA2011 3930K if you count in motherboards and RAM - should you opt for ECC
• Slow by any standard today compared to even stock speed systems, with no overclocking potential to fix it
• Will draw more power than any i7 @ stock speeds for no performance gain.
  

 

So. Long story short: you either invest a lot more into getting a mid-high end Xeon model for dual CPU processing, or you just go straight for a higher clocked mainstream/enthusiast processor. Prices in your area might be much different, but here you will need 2x $200 for the E5-2603s + $350-500 for a dual LGA2011 motherboard.

For that kind of money you could buy a SB-E cpu/mobo like the 3930K which will be in a class of its own in comparison. For the most of us, a LGA 3770K/Z77 board will do just fine and will be much cheaper than both the above configs.

 

Remember: most of the stuff we do in our desktop computers/workstations - virtually anything that is not rendering/video trans-coding/applying certain PS filters etc, is not heavily multi-threaded. Even applications like 3DS Max, Maya, Revit, Photoshop etc, use only one of our threads/cores at any given time while we model/work/modify/texture/prepare for print, thus single core (or single threaded) performance is still very important. For the bulk of our productive needs (everything before you hit export/render etc), an i5 quad (4C/4T), i7 quad(4C/8T) or i7 hex (6C/12T) will be more or less equally fast clock for clock.

[bertjow1]

thanks Dimitris for a long and comprehensive response.

I gave up Xeon-s This option seems to exceed my financial capabilities.

 

 

So left me 2 options:

 

 

But first, a little about me: I have been designing furniture so 90% renderings is furniture for catalogs and websites - study lighting system, some time interiors.

But I am also study architecture so.. soon I will start creating exterior renders, and here 1.000.000 leaves of the tree will come... so.. in viewport good card will be needed that why I think of quadro 600 or 2000.

 

 

1) Invest in the future and buy the i7-3930K + board on 2011 + up to 8GB RAM (2x4GB) and a weaker AC add my old GF 4650 ... and over time improve the weak links in the future.

 

2) i7-3770K with some good Z77 board 16 GB good framework + AC + Quadro Quadro 600 or even 2000. It seems to me that this is a good set for the day, without the possibility of further extension.

 

So I questioned with regard to the two configurations:

 

1)

- i7-3930K - clear case

- Board for 2011 - which ensure a cheapest (although none of them is cheap ..)

- Ram memory - with one?

 

2)

- i7-3770K - clear

- Z77 board - which one to choose is a whole lot of them

- Ram memory - which

- AC - which is good

- cooling - which (passive or active) and which model.

- Quadro600 or 2000 - you know that 2000 is better, I mean that I need only to 3ds card and CAD - I do not care for card games.

 

 

Best regards

[Dimitris Tolios]

The rule of thumb for most "budget limited" decisions, is "if I am not sure I need it, I probably don't"

- at least that's how i think about it.

 

I am contemplating the buy of a 3930K myself the last few months, but since it will be for my home workstation, I keep postponing it - doubt I will juice this CPU/Mobo combo enough to justify the increase in cost. Ofc there is the 3820 Quad core for the s2011/X79 platform that will give you pretty decent O/C up to 4.75GHz and is clock to clock comparable to 2600/2700K LGA1155 CPUs while maintaining the main X79 platform advantages:

 

• Support for 6C/12T upgrades now (SB-E like the 3930K) and in the future (IB-E)
  
• Up to 64 GB or Ram vs. 32GB for the LGA 1155.
  
• Quad channel RAM: greatly increased memory through-output in comparison to LGA1155, but ofc you need at least 4x dimms for that (4x4 or 4x8 are the minimum). VRay/Mray are not exactly picky on that tho, care much more for the cores/threads so not a deal maker advantage for this.
  
• More native PCIe slots - in case you need more than 3x GPU cards for accelerated rendering in supporting engines. That's available in certain Z77 boards too tho with expansion chips added.
  
• More overclocking options - mainly you can boost the CPU using both multiplier and FSB (block frequency) independently of the rest of the board's components, while the LGA1155 boards is pretty much only through multiplier.
  

 

For the dedicated workstation, it boils down to "will I use the 6C/12T enough" or not. 3820 is a "filler" CPU that buys you into 6C/12T upgrade possibility - won't do anything more than a 2600K/3770K really (maybe draws more power). It comes at a great price here in the US tho - at least for those with access to a Microcenter store ($229+tax) or other local dealers.

 

Yes, good X79 mobos that offer 4x PCIe 16x with proper spacing for 4x double slot GPUs are not cheap. When you get a 3770K for $290 and a Mobo with 3x PCIe 16x, wifi etc for $190-210 or more basic motherboards in the $130-150 range, things get ugly for the x79.

 

Now -

For the VGA. I was never a big Quadro fan. GT/GTX nvidias do the job for light ACAD/3DS tasks just fine. For the gazillion leaves etc, you use adaptive viewport settings or you simply hide them with proxies/layers etc. No need to see them all the time, and having lots of them would make most cards struggle - surely a Quadro 2000 is not powerful enough to avoid such tricks with intensively complex scenes anyways.

Personally I favor AMD FirePro cards much more than low end Quadros. The really expensive Quadros (5000/6000) do offer at least decent CUDA/OpenCL ontop of good viewport capabilities. FirePro V3900->V5900 pretty much kill Quadro 600->4000 in most stuff afaik, and do so with better pricing. AMD Radeons are very good with viewports too. Drivers haven’t been an issue with AMD cards for years now. The only real issue for me is that latest AMD cards don’t work with VRay RT - a huge shame since 79xx radeons would dominate in this field.

Edited August 22, 2012 by dtolios

[bertjow1]

Once again, thank you your time and that you wrote all this valuable information.

 

I made the decision, and buy i7 3820 for LGA 2011. Weaker processor but more future-proof platform so when some..9999k come I'll be ready.

 

board: ASUS P9X79 or Gigabyte GA-X79-UD5

memory: KHX2133C11D3K4/16GX

graphic card: still not decided

 

After watching a few videos on Vray RT iRay and I liked this method of rendering ... but buying 2 x GTS 670 and 2x 250W power ... effectively scared me. Rather stick to the traditional Vray

 

So it makes no sense to spend 40% of the financial resources for to graphic card if I am intrested more in cpu render. Because of Revit quadro 600 or fire pro 4800 will be good enought.

 

I was still interested in a single Xeon ® E5-2420 (1.90 GHz, 15 MB Cache), but as I said it has a low clock. While 6 cores over time will add up to 2011.

[Dimitris Tolios]

3820 is not a bad choice by any stretch. Currently I work with an old 2x Xeon (2x 4C/4T @ 2.5GHz) system that is overall slower than that single processor, even without overclocking it.

 

I have my home workstation pieces already figured out on everything but that: Still fighting myself vs. getting the 3820 + a good X79 or the 3770K + an Asus P8Z77-V (probably the Pro but I might go for the basic one).

In the a relatively local store there is this promotion when buying a 3820+some X79 boards or 3770K with any Z77 board that gets you a $50 off the total - unfortunately not with the 3930K. The 3820 + ASUS P9X79 Pro + wifi card (i need it) combo will set me back some $100-110 more. Cooling for both will be a Thermalright Silver Arrow as I don't really see the point going for a H100 that barely surpass its performance and costs $20 more and is noisier, or needs all the fans swapped for a more efficient and quiet push-pull that gets it into XSPC WC loop kits price ranges.

 

I want to work with VRay RT, so I will probably get a 670 SC 4GB to avoid the some cheaper yet much noisier and power hungry 580 3GB.

 

The difference between a 3770K + P8Z77-V and a 3930K + ASUS P9X79 Pro + wifi is almost another 670 SC 4GB card...then again going 3820 and having the ability to go for the 3930K or another hex-core is nice, but that means also that something inside will be burning me to do so even if I don't need to...

 

....choice, choices...as you can see I am troubled myself.

 

edit: ended up getting a cheap wifi N card and the P9X79 Pro + 3820 combo...will be O/Cing the thing under my Thermalright SA...hopefully getting more than 4.75GHz out of it which is the norm (multiplier 38x / strap 1.25). Getting 200MHz more than an IB helps the SB match its performance - I am hopping to do the same with the SB-E, but it is knit-picking after one point.

Edited August 26, 2012 by dtolios