Learn VRay

[Chris MacDonald]

I've seen a multitude of posts on here regarding render settings, and I'm sure the Mental Ray forum probably suffers the same afflictions, and this in itself isn't a problem as I really do like helping people, but...

 

The number of times I see people starting out in VRay and they post their settings asking what's wrong, and they all appear to be using arbitrary values and settings that make little sense outside of specific situations seems to be growing.

 

Am I the only person here that took the time to read the relevant parts (practically all) of the VRay manual? I don't consider myself to be an authority on the software, but I've at least taken the time to learn what things do rather than following tutorials that simply state "put this value in here, and turn this thing up".

 

I'd highly recommend to anybody looking to learn VRay to read through the entire manual long before going on to any tutorials. I say this not because tutorials are a bad thing, but because they will only ever teach you one persons way to do something. If you can sit and watch a tutorial and think "I don't think I'll follow that part because x" then you'll probably do far better than blindly following render settings, and you'll far more easily be able to troubleshoot your problems on your own.

 

[/end rant]

Edited August 23, 2013 by Macker

[notamondayfan]

Got to agree with you, although I never read a manual from start to finish, but I'm constantly referencing the manuals, forums and other training material.

 

For Vray, spot 3D is always my first call if I need to know anything, then forums, then google, then posting on forums.

 

I think a lot of the time people ask questions without thinking, or without playing. Vray isn't simple, and does take some time to learn, but you only learn by doing and reading.

 

Dean

[beestee]

I'm afraid that if somebody is not seeking out and reading a manual, they will probably skip right past this thread as well.

 

It is a little work, but when these questions come up and I happen to be one of the first answering, I will hint at a solution then link to the manual for the definitive answer when appropriate. Sometimes people are just not aware that there are so many resources available, and sometimes they are just lazy, but I prefer to give everyone the benefit of doubt and offer them a way to do a little research themselves. I have gotten a few responses where the person is obviously just looking for specific settings and unwilling to do any legwork themselves to get there. I will typically bow out at that point and let them struggle with it or somebody else may step in and oblige them.

[Chris MacDonald]

I'm afraid that if somebody is not seeking out and reading a manual, they will probably skip right past this thread as well.

 

Sadly, this is probably true.

[evanmichalski]

First off before I say anything, I agree with you 100%. Now with that out of the way...

 

Yes, there are tons of lazy individuals who would rather get instant help from a human individual, when simply reading the manual (like myself 14 times in 2 years) could solve perhaps 65% of the questions in the forums. However, cg modelling and rendering in itself is one of the most challenging aspects of an architectural firm, film studio, or any visualization process. Not only do we have to have a basic understanding of the technological and analytical lingo required of the left brain, but then you have the equal challenge of the right brain, the relationship of space, lighting, environment, artistic expression, and how to apply both of these hemispheres in synchronicity. Something I've struggled with my the last 8 years I've started modelling.

 

The problem I've always had with V-Ray is not that I don't like it, quite the contrary, I'm in love with V-Ray like I'm in love with a Flamenco dancers rhythm, but that V-Ra alone requires so much complex and critical thinking, that I've come to the conclusion that the 10,000 hour rule should be 20,000 in my case because I'm so slow at picking things up like many of you guys already have. I have ADHD, and if anyone has the least bit of understanding what that means, you'll know how much harder trying to accomplish any project, no matter how small it is. I know what caustics do and can navigate the parameters fairly well, but reading a manual alone isn't gonna help try to figure out why I can't figure why the bottom of of this pool isn't reflecting like I see in the manual. What's worse is when I try to make a custom texture. Never mind the fact you already have to understand Photoshop and all of it's functionality, but you're not gonna get anywhere with a manual when it comes to understanding the difference in saturation levels when making a reflection and glossy texture map. And does it make a difference if I use an HDRI with a V-Ray sun, and should I even consider it? Will the manual tell me that? Don't even get me started on this tutorial http://bertrand-benoit.com/blog/2010/03/31/frank-gehry-style-titanium-scales/, 3 years and I still haven't figured out how to replicate this simple material, and it drives me insane all the time, it's written down perfectly step by step with pictures of the whole process, but for the life of me I can't wrap my head around the conceptualization of producing it myself.

 

I'm not saying my situation is unique and because of this mental handicap that I deserve special treatment, I don't, in fact I think one of the reasons why I continue struggling with V-Ray is because I refuse to ask for help, I'm just a stubborn prideful mule sometimes. But for individuals who are new to the game or simply never had mentors to coach them through the first couple of years, the only way they're gonna learn is through forums, and sometimes that requires asking the dumb questions, which to them, isn't so dumb because they've already spent 36 hours trying to solve a problem that would of taken 15 minutes with the push just in the right direction. Which is why I love watching YouTube videos, because it's like having the teacher right by your side, you can save the videos and watch them whenever you want, and they explain things that a manual couldn't. It's the human element that makes all the difference sometimes. so why I've read the V-Ray manual more than Green Eggs And Ham at age 6 should explain why we need a better way of explaining a complicated software such as this.

 

What helps the most is when the manual shows you actual examples such as this, http://help.chaosgroup.com/vray/help/150SP1/examples_vraysun_sky.htm. These are actual tangible results that make sense, they're visualized, and they give you the settings without appearing arbitrary in the first place. So I wish the manual was consistent through the book. Hell I wish there was a book that explained every parament in V-Ray with examples, do's and don'ts, render times, redundant high quality settings, links to actual video's explaining further in detail what the more complicated areas of V-Ray. Don't get me wrong, I know they exist, I have Ronen Bekerman, CG Tutors, CG Blog, Peter Guthrie, Viscorbel, all of them bookmarked, but it would be nice to have all of these useful sources of knowledge coalesced to one unified area of the manual.

 

I can only speak for myself, but I hate hate asking these dumb questions, because I know they are trivial to you guys, but for me it's the difference of saving days of struggling when I could simply swallow my pride and ask for help. I'm extremely grateful though that I do have places such as these forums where I am able to pose questions or concerns, but for a lot of people around the world, I'm sure many gave up after trying so hard to do this on their own. If it wasn't for the internet I would of given up myself a long time ago. Typically, people who actually take the time to physically find this site, register, and post, shows that they're already fully committed to improving their skills because they're not satisfied with the manual alone. So anytime I'm in a position where I get to teach or help someone struggling here, I will do it, not because I have to, but because I know what it's like to feel like a true noob.

 

I hope in the future the guys at Chaosgroup follow the same path as the guys at Zbrush, because the way they are way ahead of the game when it comes to pumping out useful sources of information, especially with the insane amount of video tutorials they have. I'd be using that program every day if I had any sort of artistic ability like you see in the Zbrush Gallery, that is what you call gifted talent. Point is, more video tutorials, pictures with examples from the manual alone would solve so many questions, and hell it would actual benefit their sales too. Win win for everyone...

[notamondayfan]

Perhaps if you put "free chocolate" in the title, more people will pay attention....

[cg_Butler]

I purchased the first version of this book VRay - The Complete Guide It's a great and over the last four years have probably dipped in to every section and read parts if not all of each.

 

Even now it's still relevent, but needs updating to VRay 2.0

 

I think the problem is that the people who see visuals and what to create them, assume it can be achieved instantly and rely on others to tell them what to do. I totally agree it's far more beneficial to read what each setting does, so that you have the knowledge to trouble shoot problems by yourself, without relying on others to try and second guess the problem.