Are there some elite level viz tutorials available anywhere?

[stayinwonderland]

I've just been doing some in-house, freelance Photoshop work at one of the UK's top archi viz companies.

 

I'd applied as a potential 3d arch viz freelancer (only to find out it was full-time only) but at the interview, they showed me their work and it was unlike anything I'd ever seen before. Especially the interiors. Some of the biggest clients/names in the world.

 

As such they turned me down on the viz side of things but noticed I had an eye for Photoshop and brought me in to help out in post.

 

But it really got me thinking... where does one learn to do such high quality work? Mainly on the interior side of things. Pretty much all of the tutorials I've seen advertise the final image, kinda "this is what you'll achieve...". But said image is always just a bit average.

 

But specifically, 3ds max, Vray and interiors.

 

Any thoughts?

[Corey Beaulieu]

I think that really high level work comes from the artist being really observant and picky about the details that should be. Add to this, in a studio environment, there is no shortage of people willing make comments about the work and when you can start appeasing all of these people, great work starts to emerge.

 

There may be someone selling a high level tutorial, but my feeling on that would be that it would be very specific to their output. Good/great work needs a custom setup.

 

My suggestion would be to get a photograph from a high level photographer of magazine and set about recreating as many of the details in terms of lighting and material without the use of photoshop. Then use PS to punch it up at the end. Treat rendering more like a photographer. get a good raw and then shape/stylize it in post.

 

Just my 2 cents.

[Dave Buckley]

Mind me asking who the studio was?

 

Regardless, I doubt you'll find what your looking for. Perhaps the CGSchool stuff sold on here?

 

But as mentioned above, the elite guys have simply been doing it for a while, have a sound understanding of photography/lighting/composition (all stuff gained through looking at stuff already available to you, i.e. the world you walk around in, the internet). They will also have a great technical understanding of their chosen 3d packages - i'm assuming you're a 3ds max/vray guy? If so I'd look into the Grant Warwick Mastering Vray Course.

 

The other reason as mentioned above, will be attention to detail especially in modelling and materials, the Grant Warwick courses will help with both of those.

 

Finally they will also know what (if anything) is lacking from a raw render, and so what they need to do to it in post to make it 'shine'. Again this will simply be gained from experience and comparisons of your renders against photographs etc.

 

Oh and also having other people around you every day who also have a keen eye. I know in our studio we sit and criticise/compliment everybodies images before they go out of the studio. 9 times out of 10 they get butchered by clients but that's a different story.

 

Hope it helps

[RyderSK]

I would love to know the name of studio too..I don't think it would be impolite to reveal it. Was it Hayes-Davidson ?

Man, I would kill to spend day in some of these studios :- ) I never really worked anywhere at all and I sort of miss the type of knowledge you can only attain in such collectives.

 

But yeah, there are no high-level tutorials on Archviz, but there is so much other stuff you can just generally scrap together, for example Bertrand Benoit published tons of scattered know-how on his blog. But there is no easy-served solution :- ).

 

 

But imho best improvement comes through self-reflection and self-critique. The best in their field often had no one to compare themselves to, they simply perfected their own works through super keen observation. If someone is so blind he absolutely needs outsider's view, I sort of doubt he has the capacity to truly reach high enough.

[stayinwonderland]

Thanks for all the useful info guys. I'll address each response

 

Corey - That's a good idea actually. I'm also a digital painter and the standard practice to improve skills there is to study a photo like-for-like. But post-production can do so much for realism. I guess though it's about seeing how far you can take the 3d and not rely on the post.

 

Dave - Hi Dave, I went for an interview with the Neighborhood a year or two ago. The guy who runs the company I'm referring to here may have mentioned you in the interview (if you're one of the company owners?) Do you know a Vincent who owns a leading arch viz studio? Thanks for the tip, I've made a note of that course!

 

RyderSK - Thanks for the tip off about the BB3viz site. I had heard of that (someone at the interview I had with The Neighborhood actually). Will have a good look around.

 

Juraj - Well, you're about the only person who has done interiors that could hold a candle to these guys, so don't feel too bad!

 

In terms of revealing who they are, there's no point. I have lived a 25 minute walk from their office and tried to get involved with them a few times (and not having a clue of how good they were). Their web site shows a handful of fairly good pieces so I thought they could use me. So at the interview, the MD just sits me down in front of this large monitor and shows me their stuff... and I just wanted to cry/run away. They don't advertise on their site, or full stop actually. They don't even give you samples if you call them up. Their work and client base is pretty tight and when someone calls them for work, they're figuring out of the client is good enough rather than the other way round.

 

But I'm sat there (during my temporary week doing photoshop stuff), not really knowing anyone and not really in a position to drill anyone for info. To my right is this guy doing insane interiors and then one of the top guys will wander over and laugh at it, saying it's not very good etc. and I'm like WTF!? Crazy.

 

All I'll say is that they're based in the UK and had a job advertised on CGA's facebook page about two weeks ago. So if you're man enough, check it out and apply. But be warned, if you get an interview, they'll tear you a new ass hole! (in terms of your portfolio)

[heni30]

.............er, this company had a help wanted ad:

 

http://www.visualisationone.com/index.php?id=about

 

 

do I get the prize?

 

I really think it's about how bad you want it. You are lucky to have your foot in the door.

 

I think if you showed them unbelievable enthusiasm and persistence; were willing to do ANYTHING; and just plunged into it 110% for a couple of years, you could acquire those skills.

 

I would just start a rendering and then begin asking for opinions and advice, take the guy out on your right for a beer and tell him you just happen to have these extra soccer match tickets he's welcome to, etc. etc. etc.

 

However this kind of approach is best done in your 20's. Success favors boldness.

Edited September 26, 2014 by heni30

[RyderSK]

Never even heard of them, but it does look really good !

 

"..is a market leading" I am pretty sure I've seen this sentence in every single US/UK studio I've came across on web :- ) So many leaders out there these days.

[stayinwonderland]

You win the prize

 

Although I have to correct you, at the interview, I MIGHT have been given at least a trial if I'd been in love with arch viz and got on my knees and begged for the opportunity. He's given people such breaks in the past, but it was clear that I was just supplementing my digital illustration career with arch viz work. So he told me then and there and we were both very honest, which was so refreshing. It wasn't until I showed him my illustration portfolio that he suddenly had the idea that I could be brought in to relieve some of the post production work that needed doing.

 

Any as for your suggestion of shmoozing with the other artist. Ha, you really don't know Brits very well. Brits do not like making friends with new folk. My wife is American and I have the experience of both cultures in order to make that comparison

 

But damn that video was insane.

[heni30]

As far as schmoozing goes, personality is such a HUGE factor in success.

 

I was working in this architectural office and was friends with this fun guy lowly junior level co-worker.

 

This big client (young Porsche driving guy) who was doing a large housing development drops in and while my boss was digging up some files he's walking around the studio and my friend, who can talk to anyone, strikes up a conversation about the latest Miami Heat's win. Then the conversation turns to sailing and "Yeah, my dad's got the same type but it's a 40 footer" and they're talking about jibs and main sails with laughing and joking and when the client leaves an hour later they have a date to go out and play racquetball that night!

 

For all I know the client might having switched over the project to my friend. My jaw just dropped to see this taking place.

I was this introverted recluse at the time and it was very sobering to see what a huge part shmoozing plays in the process.

 

So I went to the library the next day and checked out "How To Win Friends and Influence People", "Effective Public Speaking", "How To Tell A Good Joke", ........etc.

 

It's funny because most Brits on this forum seem very friendly who would be approachable in a social situation.

 

(and you need some floor shadows on the chairs in that flying pigs cafe)

 

Yeah, that video was great. I liked the creative use of close-ups and in and out focus shots.

Edited September 27, 2014 by heni30

[stayinwonderland]

yeah, that's always going to be a factor in success in general. I'm not a big people person but I'm honest, open and sincere and that always, I think, comes across and takes people a little by surprise. But I can't just shoot the shit and talk about beer and football. I'm more existential and controversial, which goes down like a sack of poo in your average day-to-day schmooze

 

Say, how are you seeing my bar picture? Is there some link on here which shows work that I've submitted to the gallery? Would like to see what you're seeing in case it's not a finished piece, but thanks for the crit! I struggled like hell with that bar scene.

[heni30]

A Google of Andy Walsh 3D brings up your website. I just wanted to see what kind of portfolio you were approaching these guys with.

 

Also hitting Viz Pro brings up a dozen images on the third page.

Edited September 27, 2014 by heni30

[stayinwonderland]

Ah right, cool

 

Need to start some new pieces now that my standards have quadrupled.

[davehollands]

I've tried a few different video training series - my opinion on this way of learning is still a bit undecided. I still believe the best way to learn is to try and figure it out yourself (read the manual!), rather than watching 7 hours of tutorials. HOWEVER, I bought a bunch of Viscorbel video training when he had like a 90% sale on - and honestly, it's fantastic. You're watching a master at work. His vray material series if incredible, really opened my eyes to what you can acheive with procedural ways of work, and he has a few series which cover the production of stunning interior and exterior scenes from start to finish, I would recommend this. It's honestly fantastic. Dude is a master 3d modeler too, check out some of his free tutorials.

 

Check them out.

 

http://viscorbel.com/product-category/premium-tutorials/

[TomasEsperanza]

I'm not a big people person but I'm honest, open and sincere and that always, I think, comes across and takes people a little by surprise. But I can't just shoot the shit and talk about beer and football. I'm more existential and controversial, which goes down like a sack of poo in your average day-to-day schmooze

 

Ha ha awesome, I can relate to that. It's always good to be reminded it's not just autistics (like myself) who don't relish the somewhat disingenuously hobnobbing that can occur between shameless "go-getters". I'd rather be less successful and not mix with the superficial. That's not to say that all people who are outgoing and familiar are false, but some of them just make me cringe when it's really obvious they're either thinking of money or it's the cliquey-ness that satisfies their ego.

Edited March 3, 2015 by TomasEsperanza

[eagle_ear]

where's the puke icon?

[TomasEsperanza]

where's the puke icon?

 

Feeling better yet?

[maxwood]

When you're looking at high level work you're seeing the whole image as a finished piece of work and probably days of work from multiple artists. It's easy to be intimidated by that but if you break it down in to individual tasks then it's usually nowhere near as difficult as you might think.

 

As for tutorials, I'm fairly sure there aren't any "elite" arch viz tutorials which go from start to finish but like I said - break it down. Find individual modelling, lighting, shading tutorials.