How to start your business?

[ryannelson]

I'm curious how you pro's got your start in the arch-vis business? I'm doing a bit of freelancing here and there, but my full-time job is as an intern architect while I work towards getting my full registration (in Canada to be an architect it's a masters degree , 2-3 years of internship, 6+ exams, 6 courses, and then annual fees... )

 

Specifically, I'd like to know how you approached hardware and software purchases. As a recent grad, I have a lot of student loans to pay (and will be for 10 years) and my income is enough to live on, but that's about it. Because of my debt, no bank in their right mind would grant me a business loan to start a freelancing company. Did you guys use pirated software or downloaded assets as a means to get your foot in the door, then purchase when you were able to? I'm currently using my office's resources, but I pay for that and it really cuts into my bottom line - inhibiting me from earning enough to invest in gear seriously.

 

I'm not concerned about getting work necessarily. I'm confident in my skills and ability to learn and adapt, as well I know how to network and get my work out there. Basically, do a good job, don't burn bridges, don't be afraid, don't let yourself be taken advantage of, and be fair.

 

What route did you guys go?

[philippelamoureux]

I'm starting too and for the hardware, I just use my normal ''gaming'' pc, which is decent enough to make a good workstation. (i7, gtx 670, 16gb of ram, couple SSD's). Instead of buying render nodes you can rely on online render farm to help you finish the most demanding tasks. Eventually you can buy more pc if you want.

 

For software, it's always tempting to download pirated software but nowadays a lot of companies offer a subscription model, which I really like when you don't want to spend a fortune just to try new soft. All Adobe products can be paid monthly for a small cost (from 9,99 for photoshop cc for example). Corona is going to have the same model, and it's dirt cheap. Unreal Engine is 20$/month. Even 3ds Max can be paid monthly...it's roughly 185$ tho.

 

If you still have your student's ID, it may come in handy. I got the 1.20 Octane render version for free just by emailing them a picture of my ID! Corona will have a plan for student, it's roughly 25-30 euros per YEAR!

 

At least now there are solutions targeted at freelancers.

[jensandersen]

Well is becoming a licensed architect a dream of yours? I find it odd that you want to start your own business doing arch viz, but the main focus of your post seems to be about the troubles staying a float (money wise) while you are doing your internship. Why not just drop the internship and pursue what you really want? ie see if you can get a job that actually gives you a + on the bank account while trying to setup your business on the side?

Is it possible for your to take a sabbatical for like a year and just get back to it if things don’t plan out?

 

As Philippe said a decent gaming pc should suffice for hardware, just keep the 3d relatively simple and maybe do most of the work in photoshop. With that I don’t really see the need for render nodes at this stage (unless you want to do animations).

You get 3ds max free as a student (might be something with commercial work, but meh...). Corona seems like a "must" for freelancers. The alpha 6 version will stay free for ever and is actually very good. Add to that: trials, student friendly prices, free scripts (lots of great stuff on scriptspot.com) and free models (there are actually decent stuff out there: http://www.3dgoodplace.com/?orderby=menu_order&post_type=product ) I think you can have a great start since you already seem to have some sort of network going via your office contacts.

[ryannelson]

Well is becoming a licensed architect a dream of yours? I find it odd that you want to start your own business doing arch viz, but the main focus of your post seems to be about the troubles staying a float (money wise) while you are doing your internship. Why not just drop the internship and pursue what you really want? ie see if you can get a job that actually gives you a + on the bank account while trying to setup your business on the side?

Is it possible for your to take a sabbatical for like a year and just get back to it if things don’t plan out?

 

As Philippe said a decent gaming pc should suffice for hardware, just keep the 3d relatively simple and maybe do most of the work in photoshop. With that I don’t really see the need for render nodes at this stage (unless you want to do animations).

You get 3ds max free as a student (might be something with commercial work, but meh...). Corona seems like a "must" for freelancers. The alpha 6 version will stay free for ever and is actually very good. Add to that: trials, student friendly prices, free scripts (lots of great stuff on scriptspot.com) and free models (there are actually decent stuff out there: http://www.3dgoodplace.com/?orderby=menu_order&post_type=product ) I think you can have a great start since you already seem to have some sort of network going via your office contacts.

 

The student pricing method is a pretty good route to go down. I've been out of school for about a year now though, but there's no expiry on my student ID... grad students... haha! Rhino is quite cheap for students too and I purchased CS6 as a student so I'm good with that for now.

 

I'm interested in getting my registration, i'm not that far off so i feel as though it's important enough to complete. I'm sure you know though, that architecture really doesn't pay that well - hence my freelancing. I know that arch vis can be lucrative if you're talented and business savvy. I also do photography on the side, mostly weddings in the summer so the winter is downtime and I would like to earn a bit more.

 

I'll have to fire up Corona and start testing with that, it looks quite promising.

 

I have a decent rig in mind based on an i7-5820k, 32gb ram, GTX 970 etc... that I'm currently saving up for. If i'm working from home though, I work through parallels on my iMac which is far from ideal.

 

I have a basic roadmap set out and I know i'll get there eventually, I just get impatient sometimes! I was also very curious to see how other people tackle this though. It seems the majority of people are relatively young and in similar positions as far as income goes.

 

Thanks for the responses!

[philippelamoureux]

That pc setup is a beast. More than enough to start. If you have no experience at all with render engines, get Corona. V-ray takes a while to master (is it even possible, lol?) Joke aside, vray has so many settings that I find it overwhelming sometimes. Trying to figure out what does what and what has an incidence on other things. Corona is simpler, you can focus on your art pretty much right at the start. Octane render is very simple too.

 

I'm quite limited with upgradability on my pc but it's a portable machine (alienware x51) that i tweaked to my taste. I need the portability because I do 3d at home and at work on the same pc. it's an i7 2600, 16gb of ram and a gtx 670 2gb, with 2 ssd. If I have trouble rendering at high res I just rely on rebusfarm online render farm...dead simple solution!!!

[jensandersen]

Yeah I know the feeling, though I decided not to spend another 2½years on getting my masters just to enter a crazy low employment rate for architects (at least in this country).

I just bought pretty much the same rig as you have in mind. I settled for a 760 card though. Saved the 200$ and added that to get a better monitor than originally intended. Haven't had viewport problems with this card. But I am not doing any really complex scattering either.

 

Best of luck to you Ryan, I am sure we'll here more about your endeavor

[ryannelson]

Yeah I know the feeling, though I decided not to spend another 2½years on getting my masters just to enter a crazy low employment rate for architects (at least in this country).

I just bought pretty much the same rig as you have in mind. I settled for a 760 card though. Saved the 200$ and added that to get a better monitor than originally intended. Haven't had viewport problems with this card. But I am not doing any really complex scattering either.

 

Best of luck to you Ryan, I am sure we'll here more about your endeavor

 

I'm looking forward to see what I can do! I'm just going to splurge for the good card, I might as well. I already bought an Asus PB278q for photo editing, so I'm in good shape i think. It's a brilliant monitor!

 

Thanks Jens, you have certainly not heard the last of me. I plan on sticking around for the long haul!

 

That pc setup is a beast. More than enough to start. If you have no experience at all with render engines, get Corona. V-ray takes a while to master (is it even possible, lol?) Joke aside, vray has so many settings that I find it overwhelming sometimes. Trying to figure out what does what and what has an incidence on other things. Corona is simpler, you can focus on your art pretty much right at the start. Octane render is very simple too.

 

I'm quite limited with upgradability on my pc but it's a portable machine (alienware x51) that i tweaked to my taste. I need the portability because I do 3d at home and at work on the same pc. it's an i7 2600, 16gb of ram and a gtx 670 2gb, with 2 ssd. If I have trouble rendering at high res I just rely on rebusfarm online render farm...dead simple solution!!!

 

I've been using Vray for a couple years now, but only seriously learning it now. I'm familiar enough with how it works to be able to push it, but I'm for sure going to give Corona a shot once I dive into 3dsmax more. I've never tried to farm a render out before, maybe I'll check that out too if I'm in a pinch before i get this new rig!

[Scott Schroeder]

A word of caution on using student versions of software. You do realize that using student software for-profit violates the license agreement right? You also realize that when we get files from freelancers and we get the "This software was created with a student license" that we withhold all payment and blacklist them for eternity. Once you are labeled a cheat, this industry becomes even smaller and harder to land work than it already is. So, just some food for thought.

 

Even in the case of Corona where you can use student software to make money, you are no longer a student so why cheat them? Even more so in their case where their professional licenses are incredibly reasonable.

 

If you want to be a professional, act professional and get all proper licenses. It's expensive, but this isn't a cheap industry to be in to begin with.

[ryannelson]

A word of caution on using student versions of software. You do realize that using student software for-profit violates the license agreement right? You also realize that when we get files from freelancers and we get the "This software was created with a student license" that we withhold all payment and blacklist them for eternity. Once you are labeled a cheat, this industry becomes even smaller and harder to land work than it already is. So, just some food for thought.

 

Even in the case of Corona where you can use student software to make money, you are no longer a student so why cheat them? Even more so in their case where their professional licenses are incredibly reasonable.

 

If you want to be a professional, act professional and get all proper licenses. It's expensive, but this isn't a cheap industry to be in to begin with.

 

Some software offers full commercial licenses to students. Like 3dsmax for example, offers a full 3-year commercial license for free. I think the intention with that is to allow the student enough time to work with the program to add incentive for purchase later. That's not cheating in any way. Also, the Corona alpha version (6?) is a FREE version, not just student, the only drawback is that it's an alpha version and not subject to development or support.

 

I fully intend on being legit. My question was more about how people typically *get* there. Thanks for the word of caution though, any advice is much appreciated.

[Tommy L]

Your business will start with relationships. Talk to people. Contact all your contacts. Not just email, I mean you need to be face to face with people, old school. How you buy the software is secondary. Even your portfolio is secondary.

If your clients are not paying you enough to afford the right tools then you need to either use cheap tools or get better clients.

[Scott Schroeder]

Some software offers full commercial licenses to students. Like 3dsmax for example, offers a full 3-year commercial license for free. I think the intention with that is to allow the student enough time to work with the program to add incentive for purchase later. That's not cheating in any way. Also, the Corona alpha version (6?) is a FREE version, not just student, the only drawback is that it's an alpha version and not subject to development or support.

 

I fully intend on being legit. My question was more about how people typically *get* there. Thanks for the word of caution though, any advice is much appreciated.

 

Check your source on that first one with 3ds max. This is directly from the autodesk educational website. Yes you get 3 years, but no you can't use it for commercial purposes.

Can I use free Educational licenses for Autodesk software obtained through the Education Community for commercial purposes?

 

No. Software and cloud-based services provided without charge to Education Community members may be used solely for purposes directly related to learning, training, research or development. Such software and cloud-based services shall not be used for commercial, professional or any other for-profit purposes.

[ryannelson]

Check your source on that first one with 3ds max. This is directly from the autodesk educational website. Yes you get 3 years, but no you can't use it for commercial purposes.

 

My mistake, I must have been thinking of something else!

[philippelamoureux]

I'm only using Octane student because their demo sucks (old max plugin version +very limited res + watermark). How are you even supposed to test the renderer before spending 460 euros. They need to step their game in that department. Corona is still free but it will be more than happy subscribe once it's possible, and get all the updates and stuff. I agree with Scott, for cheap soft like that there are no excuses!!! And i've never sold anything yet haha. Just a Photoshop touch-ups job made with a adobe CC subscription. :-P

 

I remember people were reluctant to pay for the unreal engine 4 subsription and it was 19,99$/month lol. If people can't imagine paying that for a huge soft like ue4, there's something wrong somewhere. lol

[RyderSK]

 

I remember people were reluctant to pay for the unreal engine 4 subsription and it was 19,99$/month lol. If people can't imagine paying that for a huge soft like ue4, there's something wrong somewhere. lol

 

I remember this so well... even after they made it publicly clear you can buy it once and UDK will stay free forever, tons of people accused them completely of greediness,etc.. and these were almost all Americans.

 

While game industry is differently devised from business side (most people are employed in medium to larger scale studios, and thus don't own their own tools like in Archviz), doing so much whining and in such a tasteless fashion (from insults to emotional tantrums) was too much for me to comprehend.

 

Damned capitalists, what did they think ? 20 dollars ? [for engine that...ok, some time ago, used to cost 800k+ to licence for single title...]

[Nic H]

i started my first architectural vis work years ago by knowing people and having good relationships with them. i even did some pro bono work which is a gamble but i was young and it paid off.

 

i know this discussion is about software and hardware but its such is such a small part of it all! there is a much wider discussion to be had involving all the other aspects of a business i..... accounts, sales, management, contracts, staff, premises (even if its your own home) taxes

 

i started with a full suite of cracked software 13 years ago (it was much too expensive back then - we used to get it on CD's from the malaysian students at uni who could buy it at markets back home) these days im legit and its more affordable for people generally with better licensing terms.

 

anyway my advice is do what you need to do to get started and making cash as its going to be tougher than you think! Best of luck

[RyderSK]

 

anyway my advice is do what you need to do to get started and making cash as its going to be tougher than you think! Best of luck

 

+.

Far more refreshing to read than the usual moral high ground.

 

 

The original question is extremely naive, no one sensible flaunts their 'flawed' opportunistic sides, surely not on public anglo forum where people like to frequently mention this general lynching idea or community dissociation, in actual reality, no one cares, no one has time to bother or judge others. Everything has consequence which are up to you to deal with but following common sense can range greatly on shades of grey scale, there isn't special place in haven.

 

Heh I tried so hard to avoid this topic, but Nic's response uplifted my mood :- ). This is far better discussion to be had in pub then on forum.

[ryannelson]

+.

Far more refreshing to read than the usual moral high ground.

 

 

The original question is extremely naive, no one sensible flaunts their 'flawed' opportunistic sides, surely not on public anglo forum where people like to frequently mention this general lynching idea or community dissociation, in actual reality, no one cares, no one has time to bother or judge others. Everything has consequence which are up to you to deal with but following common sense can range greatly on shades of grey scale, there isn't special place in haven.

 

Heh I tried so hard to avoid this topic, but Nic's response uplifted my mood :- ). This is far better discussion to be had in pub then on forum.

 

This is the kind of discourse I was kind of hoping for. Something just kind of... honest. I hadn't really anticipated any kind of community dissociation or people taking the moral high-ground. Ok, the question was naive, but I'm new to the industry and I intend on learning fast. I have always been the guy to raise my hand to ask a dumb question. Better to ask a dumb question than make a dumb mistake I think.

 

I'm down for a pint in the pub, anyone in Vancouver? ha!

[RyderSK]

No snow calamity over there now ;- ) ? Got one here right now.

[ryannelson]

Quite the opposite! It's like 13 degrees C and sunny

[heni30]

i started with a full suite of cracked software 13 years ago (it was much too expensive back then - we used to get it on CD's from the malaysian students at uni who could buy it at markets back home)

 

Dear Mr. Nicnic:

 

We regret to inform you that in light of information of an incriminating nature that has surfaced recently, you are hereby Banished for Eternity from the International Fraternal Order of Architectural Visualizers. All benefits, privileges and titles are hereby revoked.

 

While we applaud your honesty and courage in coming forth, this decision is final and cannot be appealed.

 

Wishing you the best in future endeavors,

 

The IFOAV

 

 

 

 

(sorry, couldn't help myself...................late and I'm tired..................)

Edited January 31, 2015 by heni30

[Nic H]

but im reformed!

[ryannelson]

haha I like where this going

[petesedlacek]

Glad you are thinking of taking the plunge! I got lucky, in that my software and hardware purchases happened organically. I didn't wake up one day thinking "Okay, time to buy everything." I built my computer, which probably saved my 30% of the cost. Bought Max a few years ago to do a little freelance here and there, so I had that (Same with adobe CS.) Bought the student license of Vray to learn it. So when I finally decided to make the leap to Freelance Full-time, all I had to do was upgrade Vray (which is cheaper than buying outright.)

 

I guess if I had any advice for you, it would be to seriously build your own computer. You'll learn a lot, save a bunch of money, and it's not as scary as it sounds. And as for software, my advice is if you're going to use it to make money, then buy a license. I know that's not the easiest answer, but consider that in one or two projects you could recover all the costs, and then it's all profit after that (minus subscription fees.) This is a relatively cheap field to be in, regarding operating expenses. I mean it might cost 5-8k to get up and running, but that's nothing compared to the years and years... thousands of hours required to learn how to do it, right?