craigellison Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 So I've recently graduated from Uni with a degree in Video Game art, I got a decent grade at a 2:1 however the industry is a pig to get into (especially at my age) as there are too many overly enthusiastic 20 something year olds to contend with. Whilst perusing the job websites I notied a few arch viz vacancies being advertised and noticed that lots of the skills I have are interchangeable. My question is.. other than 3ds and photoshop(which I'm already proficient with) are there any other packages that I should try and learn? what's the industry standard? and how easy is it to get your foot in the door? I'm currently exploring all options to find work so any help would be greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryhirsch Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 again...there is a search function..we had this topic like 10 times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris MacDonald Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 You'll need to be proficient with a render engine. Often firms ask for experience with VRay, though this is sometimes because "they heard it's good" and you may be able to convince them that Mental Ray (or whatever) is the way to go, and other times it's because they've already got a large VRay pipeline that you will simply have to fit into. You'll also need a basic knowledge of CAD software such as AutoCAD, but this is fairly simple to pick up and learn. I think an eye for composition and lighting goes a long way, as does an understanding of how buildings are put together. You'll soon learn (in the uk) that a brick course is 75mm, and that standard doors are 2100mm high, etc. These things are generally learned in practice though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigellison Posted January 5, 2016 Author Share Posted January 5, 2016 again...there is a search function..we had this topic like 10 times Sorry should really have checked first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigellison Posted January 5, 2016 Author Share Posted January 5, 2016 You'll need to be proficient with a render engine. Often firms ask for experience with VRay, though this is sometimes because "they heard it's good" and you may be able to convince them that Mental Ray (or whatever) is the way to go, and other times it's because they've already got a large VRay pipeline that you will simply have to fit into. You'll also need a basic knowledge of CAD software such as AutoCAD, but this is fairly simple to pick up and learn. I think an eye for composition and lighting goes a long way, as does an understanding of how buildings are put together. You'll soon learn (in the uk) that a brick course is 75mm, and that standard doors are 2100mm high, etc. These things are generally learned in practice though. Is there no industry standard?.. After seeing multiple vacancies advertised recently they all seem to want different software experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris MacDonald Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 Not really, though I would say that VRay is by far the most prevalent. As far as 3D software goes, 3DS max and Sketchup are kings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryhirsch Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 Chris is right...in the end all that matters is the quality that you can deliver...If you make amazing renderings with Maxwell then people will hire you. Companies have to deal with several projects at once so it is good if you can help out here and there....And then you have to deal with Revit and Rhino files but this is another topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Schroeder Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 In my opinion, it is a lot harder than the games industry to get your foot in the door within arch viz these days. One reason is that we are much smaller than games, so less jobs are available and more and more people are applying for those spots. With so many schools giving degrees in game art (most of the for-profit schools are complete junk to begin with), the market has become way over saturated. Everyone is all thinking the same way and applying for architecture jobs. If you try to apply for an in-house position with an architect with a games degree, you might get sneered at by the old boy club that thinks all you do is make pew-pew shooters. They fail to realize that architecture plays a huge role in most game environments. Two is that you have to be way more well rounded than in video games. In games you are a master of one skill and you are hired for one skill, though, this is less common with indie studios. In architecture you are expected to handle all aspects of a job. From schedules, budgets, to concept, to execution, to compositing, to lighting, to materials, to set dressing, to final comp, and to final presentation. This is especially true if you work in-house with an architect. You won't have an art director telling you what to do, where to put things, how many lens flares is too many lens flares, and when your image looks good. You need to be a self starting and be able to get that project done in 2 minutes or less, with a complete 180 degree change at the last 3 seconds before it is due. Your degree and your grades don't mean a lot, unless you plan on applying for a work Visa in the US. What matters is your portfolio. That and being able to read at a basic level a set of blueprints. I don't have time to teach someone how to use the front index to go searching for an elevation or RCP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dollus Posted January 5, 2016 Share Posted January 5, 2016 You should understand that every architecture graduate is very well versed in rendering technically-accurate images to a level the majority of firms require so you will be competing among the thousands of overly enthusiastic 20 something year olds with professional degrees in Architecture. Also, the rendering aspect has become rather commoditized so you will be competing on a global level with anyone who has a computer and an internet connection available to download the software illegally. Rendering isn't as integral to the business of architecture like the same skill set is to a game development company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 (edited) Craig, if you are coming from video game dev, you should have a look at unreal engine for archviz. It could be easier for you to learn and it will open the door for RT and VR if it's something that interests you. This is the kind of stuff you'll most likely do has a freelancer or if you have your own company tho. I doubt many architect firms or 3d studio are going to hire for that stuff for a little while. But with 3ds max, unreal and photoshop you can get very far. Like, it's basically all you need. Unreal engine 4.11 preview 1 is out and my god it's a nice update. Dropping 2 new screens made by Rafael Reis on 4.11. Keep in mind this quality is rendered in realtime and the scene is fully playable! I'm doing tests and my god 4.11 is the bomb! They just added light portals and support for intel Embree. So, speed increase and quality upgrade. Edited January 6, 2016 by philippelamoureux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigellison Posted January 6, 2016 Author Share Posted January 6, 2016 I did actually mention Unreal in another post, I'm very surprised more Architectural companies dont use it. I've got previous experience with Unreal 3 and 4 isn't that different. Need to get back upto scratch as I graduated in April/May last year and I've not done a thing since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris MacDonald Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 It doesn't fit particularly well into the architectural design process, at the moment. That's mainly why. Any time saved rendering (which let's face it is where you're getting the time saving) you can multiply by at least 2 to get to the final product in UE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Schroeder Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 As far as UE4 stuff in your portfolio, I'd stay away from the empty bedrooms with messy beds and all concrete house scenes. If I've seen 1, I've seen all 100,000,000 of the Koola copy-cats out there. It's gotten to the point of being laughably unoriginal. To stand out in that crowd you have to be really really really really good and chances are, I've seen better. Be original! I don't really care about UE4 scenes rendered in offline mode, I know they take just as long if not longer to render than doing it in Vray. Show me a scene that runs well on the web or on my 2-3 year old phone, well sir, then you are miles ahead of the pack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 great another white apartment with 1 messy bed its 2015's version 'house in the forest' or 'concrete room' i wonder what 2016 holds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Schroeder Posted January 6, 2016 Share Posted January 6, 2016 great another white apartment with 1 messy bed its 2015's version 'house in the forest' or 'concrete room' i wonder what 2016 holds... Messy beds made of concrete in the forest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 Messy beds lol! I have to agree with you i'm also tired as f*ck of interiors. Here's something more ''unreal'' The winners of the vineyard challenge. Team Factory Fifteen (who are amazing already) It may not be photoreal but there's a strong mood and story to the video. You can see it's a merge between game creation and architecture. That could suit you more Craig! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 yes i loved the FF one - very good as usual! i really want some time to explore unity or unreal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 It doesn't fit particularly well into the architectural design process, at the moment. That's mainly why. Any time saved rendering (which let's face it is where you're getting the time saving) you can multiply by at least 2 to get to the final product in UE. Yes the biggest difference is how the model is made. Big models with a lot grouped geometry (let's say all windows are 1 piece) is a huge time sink. To get nice results you have to break up things. The uv'ing/unwrapping is a nightmare of the past thanks to scripts. At least! But yea, I've spent 5 hours one time to break a model in decently sized parts to use in Unreal! If you model yourself you can avoid that problem tho. If the model isn't overly complex you can also use a script to detach all faces, delete what's not visible in the scene and regroup the rest of the faces or leave them as is and assign a uv map to each face (ideal for quality). Other than that, apart from assets library being widely accessible for V-ray, the rest of the workflow is pretty much the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Moir Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 great another white apartment with 1 messy bed its 2015's version 'house in the forest' or 'concrete room' i wonder what 2016 holds... Snow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corey Beaulieu Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 Snow Last year was the year for YouTubes of everyones Unreal project..... I'd bet this is year is the year for Gear VR Youtubes. And possibly the atmospheric Aerial thanks to Vray 3.3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turchin Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 You guys are such hipsters; there cant be more than 2 or 3 variants of something, because if you find the 3rd or the 7th its passé and something to be frowned upon if someone tries to replicate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryhirsch Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 ''2 or 3 variants'' make that 2 or 3 per day (when it come to bedrooms) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 When I do personal stuff I always try to replicate unorthodox architecture. (I've done a Chai Ballande render recently). I just don't understand why people do boring bedrooms for personal projects!!! Keep that for the boring typical commercial job!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomasEsperanza Posted January 13, 2016 Share Posted January 13, 2016 I believe it depends on whether one is actually making (almost) everything in the scene, or just being rather disingenuous and calling it your work when it's a white box populated with library assets. I mean, for example: if you make a nice piece of furniture... I don't see anything wrong with placing it in a... rather generic scene in order to show it off (white bedroom, etc). But... if it's just the room that is your own work, and the assets aren't! then it's another "bread & butter" job! ...and let's hope there is at least some originality in the composition, or post production (in order to partially redeem the work's creative integrity). It's obvious, we often have to use assets, and we often have no say over the architectural design, but there has to be some point of difference to be able to say something is... "good", "nice", "great", "amazing!". So what gets me is how often that is actually ignored. Just one redeeming factor that's all you need, and you've got something. But... no redeeming factors... and it's just crap, right? It could be The composition the technical skill, the mood... but something. So I try to be objective; it might not be the next Picasso, but "hey, nice chair" (IF ... you made it yourself ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) When I do personal stuff I always try to replicate unorthodox architecture. (I've done a Chai Ballande render recently). I just don't understand why people do boring bedrooms for personal projects!!! Keep that for the boring typical commercial job!!! It all depends where you are in your development in terms of experience, skill set and interests. I don't think it's beneficial, as a professional community, to look down condescendingly on people who are at a different level than you. .........and about "boring commercial jobs" Yeah, for better or for worse, we are a service profession. I don't know, can you move laterally within your firm to an area that would be fun/challenging learning about? Or move to a more cutting edge firm? As far as assets go, it's really subjective - what your priorities are. Modeling can be fun but it's not at the top of my list, personally - especially from a financial point of view. And I think if you gave 10 competent people a box with the same assets you would get 10 very different renderings. The thing that bothers me about true PR is that if it's truly successful your individual stamp disappears and it's hard to tell one from another unless you're a super studio with a unique signature style. Edited January 14, 2016 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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