What do you use to model?

[M V]

Curious if most Max folks are modeling in Max or if they do most of their modeling outside of Max and then link/import.

 

I'm just finding modeling to be not a great fluid experience in Max. It's just downright painful (coming from SketchUp).

[Corey Beaulieu]

I model in Max almost exclusively. I would agree that there is a learning curve, but link/importing models never goes that well so I find it important to know how to fix/re-model in Max.

 

What kind of things are you having trouble modelling?

[Francisco Penaloza]

I used to model everything in Max, but lately I found my self doing a lot in Sketchup. Since sketchup seems to be very forgiving in some aspect it seems "faster" than Max for architectural related modeling, but you could do the same within Max any ways.

What I think Max is lacking is a better control of splines, more a la CAD software. I know there are scripts and pluging that let you do that but, in sketchup by default you can do a lot with lines. Now the snaping in Sketchup is just horrible.

[innerdream]

Sketchup, there are tons of great plugins. If I need to make a organic shape that's complicated I use Modo or hire someone to make it.

[M V]

I model in Max almost exclusively. I would agree that there is a learning curve, but link/importing models never goes that well so I find it important to know how to fix/re-model in Max.

 

What kind of things are you having trouble modelling?

 

Everything. I just want to start drawing and input dimensions while I am modeling. It seems that you always have to create an object then type-in parameters. The workflow just seems convoluted to me.

[numerobis]

Now the snaping in Sketchup is just horrible.

Really? I would say the inference engine in SU is the best i have seen so far. The only thing that annoys me sometimes is that you can't disable or configure it - without the help of some plugins. But i think especially for rectangular objects it's working great. And you can easily create multiple local coordinate systems using components and then switch between them with a double click...

 

(but i always work with the highest unit precision and disabled length and angle snapping)

[philippelamoureux]

It's almost impossible to quit 3ds max even tho I don't like how it performs. It's slow, it's heavy, but it's powerful. I tried the MODO 10 demo and blender and they're fast and feels light.

 

But max has so many useful plugins (and corona renderer) that it's hard to let it go!

[M V]

This is where I am with SketchUp. I have been using it for 10 years and have been really pushing it as far as it can go, but I feel like I now need to start bringing Max into play to push even further. I don't want to totally through SketchUp out the window though. I do think I can learn modeling in Max but I am not convinced that I can model as efficiently as I do in SketchUp. Honestly, I don't know how some of you do what you do in Max as far as modeling goes. It doesn't feel intuitive or user friendly at all. I was curious if a lot of guys out there are modeling in another program, like SketchUp and then going into Max to take advantage of things like Corona and ForestPack. I know that Peter Guthrie has mentioned starting his modeling in SketchUp.

Edited April 23, 2016 by valerostudio

[innerdream]

This is where I am with SketchUp. I have been using it for 10 years and have been really pushing it as far as it can go, but I feel like I now need to start bringing Max into play to push even further. I don't want to totally through SketchUp out the window though. I do think I can learn modeling in Max but I am not convinced that I can model as efficiently as I do in SketchUp. Honestly, I don't know how some of you do what you do in Max as far as modeling goes. It doesn't feel intuitive or user friendly at all. I was curious if a lot of guys out there are modeling in another program, like SketchUp and then going into Max to take advantage of things like Corona and ForestPack. I know that Peter Guthrie has mentioned starting his modeling in SketchUp.

 

 

I model in Sketchup, Modo and Blender and render still images with Cycles. Cycles like Maxwell and other unbiased render engines is slow but the results are beautiful.

[Corey Beaulieu]

Everything. I just want to start drawing and input dimensions while I am modeling. It seems that you always have to create an object then type-in parameters. The workflow just seems convoluted to me.

 

I think it is important to remember that Max was not created specifically for the purposes of Architecture. I think this is both what makes it a strong modelling software and what makes it feel un-intuitive to those working in Architecture.

 

In the end, however, I would still liken it much more closely with Rhino/with Grasshopper than ever with Sketch Up.

[Eliot Blenkarne]

I do the bulk of my work in Sketchup still. Max modelling is just too slow and clunky for basic archi modelling - at least it is for me. Sketchup has so many sweet plugins for architectural modelling that the amount of work is reduced hugely whilst retaining great accuracy and clean modelling.

 

I use max for more complex stuff, reducing model complexity for inside sketchup and for UV mapping for UE4 though. I need to move away from rendering with Vray for Sketchup though - basic modelling in Sketchup, fine-tune in max and render in Vray/Corona for max is where I want to go, ala PG.

[M V]

You guys mind if I ask which method you use to get your SketchUp model into Max? Direct SKP import? Seems to be some weirdness with groups and components using that method.

[SkylineArch]

Now the snaping in Sketchup is just horrible.

If you're having trouble snapping in SketchUp, try to toggle on X-Ray mode, then switch back when you're done snapping.

[SkylineArch]

You guys mind if I ask which method you use to get your SketchUp model into Max? Direct SKP import? Seems to be some weirdness with groups and components using that method.

I assign all my textures in SketchUp with the final texture I'll use in Max, just colors for things that won't have texture maps (UV's), then Export as .3ds by Material. The UV's copy over and everything is split by material for easy material application.

[ludnid]

Interesting thread. I'm also a core sketchup user. I use sketchup for all of my modelling unless i really need to do parametric type stuff. Max is basically for renders however I think archviz gets boring after a while and you may want to try other angles thus the only thing making me consider max for modelling.

 

For architectural visualization however and speed, I just think sketchup is the best there is but thats my opinion anyways.

 

I used to export as *.3ds in the past but it has a maximum limit and will split your faces. Then curves could be hell unless you use welding vertices and this just triangulates your mesh in "so not nice" ways. I changed to *.skp and its been bliss so far. Infact max recognizes your component system so once I'm in, I can organize and color code things easily using Neil's Soulburn scripts. Like Mark, most texturing is done in sketchup as well.

[Eliot Blenkarne]

You guys mind if I ask which method you use to get your SketchUp model into Max? Direct SKP import? Seems to be some weirdness with groups and components using that method.

 

Yeah I generally texture inside Sketchup, then import .SKP inside Max. No real issues as yet, but I am doing this for Unreal rather than Vray etc, so just unwrap everything then export out of Max.

 

Sounds kinda like a slow workflow but Sketchup is so fast to model architecture in (orthogonal at least), I'm only inside Max for a short period. It's a means to an end.

[M V]

So I guess I have to ask... Any reason to just bag Max and render inside of SketchUp? With VRay, Thea, and Skatter, what's the advantage to going to Max at all?

[Francisco Penaloza]

Well I guess it depend of the type of work you do.

IF you are doing animations, there is no way to compare Max to Sketchup.

Also for large development, Sketchup performance decline.

But if you are doing small/medium projects, only Sketchup and VRay would be the right tool for you.

[Eliot Blenkarne]

Vray for Sketchup is still pretty antiquated in some ways - it must be around 5 years behind vray for max I reckon. You can get good results (I use it extensively) but not at the level you can achieve in vray for max. Everything is just a wee bit behind, including the plugins.The other aspect is speed, vray for max has a lot more development I would imagine?

 

From what I can gather, skp seems difficult to work with for developers compared to max at a high level, for whatever reason, be it the modelling type (destructive) or the actual base code of the program.

 

Plus, not many viz studios seem to use vray for skp, so for many, it's about staying relevant too I guess.

[Derek Forreal]

So I guess I have to ask... Any reason to just bag Max and render inside of SketchUp? With VRay, Thea, and Skatter, what's the advantage to going to Max at all?

what are you hoping to achieve moving to Max? you're asking the questions so you must be finding that the SU workflow is missing something?

[Vince Paske]

I'm pretty old school I guess as I use AutoCad to model architecture. The Boolean tools are simple and fast, the geometry links into 3ds Max with quick reloads, and if you organize your geometry on layers to the material, you limit scene clutter. I model sites and other organic things in 3dsMax.

[M V]

what are you hoping to achieve moving to Max? you're asking the questions so you must be finding that the SU workflow is missing something?

 

I guess I am feeling the peer pressure to move on to Max. Everyone else is doing it, so I guess I should too, right? I've been a viz designer/artist for 10 years now and never really touched Max. I am now thinking that if this is going to be my career for the rest of my life, I need to be using the industry standard application. It's like being an architect that only knows ArchiCAD.

 

I also just want to push my work. I feel that I have MAXed out in SketchUp as far as what I can produce goes. Pun intended. My issue I am facing is modeling in Max. It's painful and clumsy and I am wondering if it's acceptable in the arch-viz community to keep modeling in SketchUp.

[unclefarkus]

I use Revit and link the FBX. I work full time in an architecture office where my primary task is to create construction drawings and such. But I'm also the only person who knows Max and Vray, so when we have to render, it just makes the most sense to work from a linked FBX. especially when the design is still being developed while rendering.

[M V]

I do love the idea of linking although I tried the Revit FBX link thing a couple of years ago and that was painful. It took 30-40 min just to reload. I'm sure its better now though. I have even thought of using FBX linking with SketchUp for the same reason... to keep working. Also working in an arch office, we will work the design until the very last moment, then it's a click of the magic button (that has given me an ulcer).

[Derek Forreal]

I guess I am feeling the peer pressure to move on to Max

have to say, that's exactly how it's coming across.

 

and to that i would say that unless you have to use Max (those you work with insist), or you know there are specific tool(s) or features that you are missing, then what's the point of spending all that time learning different tools which essentially do the same things?

 

there's an article just out on Ronen Bekerman where a user has created some fantastic images using SU and Vray for SU:

 

http://el2.convertkit.com/c/gku94q65ps5he4eg/3ydpyg/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5yb25lbmJla2VybWFuLmNvbS9tYWtpbmctc2FybWllbnRvLW11c2V1bS8=

 

you also have Thea right? Thea can output extremely realistic images if that's what your aim is.

 

IMHO it's about understanding light, materials and composition way above using a given software. this forum is heavily Max/Vray biased, as is the industry, but they really are just tools.

 

I am now thinking that if this is going to be my career for the rest of my life, I need to be using the industry standard application. It's like being an architect that only knows ArchiCAD.

what's wrong with using ArchiCAD? does anyone honestly believe that you would become a better architect if you used Revit or Autocad instead of Archicad? or Rhino instead of FormZ, or Max instead of SU or MODO or Blender?

 

I also just want to push my work. I feel that I have MAXed out in SketchUp as far as what I can produce goes. Pun intended. My issue I am facing is modeling in Max. It's painful and clumsy and I am wondering if it's acceptable in the arch-viz community to keep modeling in SketchUp.

maxed out in what way? is the modelling lacking? do you struggle with high poly counts? are your scenes or models becoming "too complex" for SU? do you want your renders to look different?

 

i must admit i'm not a SU user so not sure what the limits are but i know the default set of tools is pretty limited. but from what i've seen there are plugins available that let you do pretty much anything.