Cesar R Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 being that 3dviz doesnt run on mac os x, has anyone with a mac tryed to make it run under virtual PC? This is the only software that I like a lot that doesnt run on mac; will it ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethace Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 More to the point, why don't Apple really just accept their status as a software OS company and stop just using the hardware as a dongle to protect their OS. What is really needed is an x86 port of MAC OS to run the software like you describe. Apple are fast running out of options with chips - IBM, AMD, Intel, Sony, Toshiba... it is all rumours and counter-rumour and speculation at the moment. But one thing is clear, Apple will have to decide where its future lies. Alot of open sourse crowd like the Linux, unix and sun people are opting to buy MAC laptops running OSX. By all accounts OSX is great for the opensourse community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Homeless Guy Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Could Apple is investing in the music bizz, as well as specialized hardware (ipod) to avoid losing revenue when they finally are forced to port their OS? It is my understanding that apple makes something like 80% of its revenue from hardware sales. If they port over, very few people would bother buying Apple hardware. IMO that vast majority of people would opt for the cheaper x86 based hardwar. Which would also offer them more options for upgrading. But I think this argument is mute, because even if Apple ported, Discreet would still have to write a Mac version. The software is OS dependent, not hardware dependent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethace Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Apple would probably lose that looney brigade, that have been following Apple like some lost sheep for too long now. But is that really any loss? A whole new bunch of computer users looking for an alternative to Microsoft would emerge to quickly replace the mac-nuts. MAC makes so much out of hardware by aiming specifically at a 1-3% well-off sector of the entire world market, by keeping itself exclusive and by charging tonnes more for their product than standard pcs. The problem is, MAC wants to stay exclusive at around 3% market share, otherwise it would lose the rich mac nut market to Sony or some other shiny case merchant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_A Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Annnyyy waaay... Cesar it will run but won't really be quick enough for full blown production work. Easier to buy a slightly used PC box for cents on the dollar and run with that. I don't expect max will ever port to OSX. There are other high quality options already there (ie Maya, Lightwave, Cinema4D) that would disuade people from switching quickly enough for them to see a return on any investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethace Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Good post Chris_A, very valid points indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cesar R Posted May 13, 2003 Author Share Posted May 13, 2003 lol, Thanks chirs; Once again i meantion I am looking into a G4 or whatever comes for at x-mas times and I am considering/ looking at the new software I will need to learn. I know CAD is not problem with archicad, photoshop and flash and dreamweaver are Mac OS. my only concern is 3d. well, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackb602 Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 Cesar, If your "only concern is 3d" then you'll be happy on OS X. I use FormZ for modeling and Cinema 4D for rendering & animation, and I think both programs are at the top of their fields. The main 3d apps that the Mac doesn't support are those from Autodesk and/or Discreet. Viz 4 will "run" on Virtual PC, but trying to render in that environment would be a form of torture. If you're planning to wait until Christmas to make a purchase. Power Macs with the new PPC 970 chip from IBM should be freely available. If the early benchmarks are any indication, they'll give the fastest Pentiums a run for their money. Hope this helps, Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernest Burden III Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 I use FormZ for modeling and Cinema 4D for rendering & animation, and I think both programs are at the top of their fields.Interesting. I am wondering: why do you choose to model in FormZ when C4D is also a modeler, also with a great 'feature list'? FormZ is giving me sticker shock at US$1500 for the modeler alone. I was thinking of buying C4D, so together its a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid Posted May 13, 2003 Share Posted May 13, 2003 If you're going to Mac, don't sleep on Electric Image Universe. You can model in ACIS solids, Nurbs, polygonal surfaces and sub-div surfaces. It has a fast renderer too. http://www.electricimage.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andymcnair Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 In terms of architectural visualisation which 3D package would be best for the Mac? I've seen lots of great art by the various programs but wonder if theres one in particular thats really good for architecture / interior design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Hess Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Power Macs with the new PPC 970 chip from IBM should be freely available. Or whatever chip apple announces. they'll give the fastest Pentiums a run for their money. The benchmarks aren't 100%. Actual comparison data puts the ppc 970 (at the benchmarked ghz) around a 2.4/2.53B Pentium IV. Hopefully they'll be released at speeds around 1.8/2.0 which will allow it to directly compete against the 3.0/3.06/3.2 chips available from intel. Of course, if its a normal apple move, they may be announced, but not made available for another 6-12 months...which means it wouldn't be competitive period. (It would be competing against Opertons/Athlon64 chips running past 2.2 ghz) I'm all for OS X... i just wish it was around 4x faster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethace Posted May 14, 2003 Share Posted May 14, 2003 Of course, if its a normal apple move, they may be announced, but not made available for another 6-12 months...which means it wouldn't be competitive period. (It would be competing against Opertons/Athlon64 chips running past 2.2 ghz) Factor in some time, for Apple to get a descent chipset worked out, adequate service packs for OSX, tweaking for the new PCC970 etc. Also factor in time for Apple users to realise they need more than 128 or 256MB of memory in this day and age. Also, beware the IBM PCC970 is really a watered down version of their multi-core, larger cache Power PCC products. Reducing the on-die cache of the Apple version to reduce cost, will big-time reduce performance. Which in 12 months time, will mean Intel and AMD will still be streets ahead of Apple. I.e. 2.4GHZ P4 performance in 12 months time? Good deal,... err, i don't think so. Compare it with products like the new integrated DX9 chipset parts from Ati, Prescott from Intel or Opteron from AMD, coupled with Longhorn OS from Microsoft. Pretty next generation stuff you know. Inside the IBM PowerPC 970 Part I: Design Philosophy and Front End http://arstechnica.com/cpu/02q2/ppc970/ppc970-1.html Inside the PowerPC 970 Part II: The Execution Core http://arstechnica.com/cpu/03q1/ppc970/ppc970-0.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 k, disregard this. I just found the edit button. [ May 15, 2003, 09:37 AM: Message edited by: Frosty ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 Originally posted by Ernest Burden: Interesting. I am wondering: why do you choose to model in FormZ when C4D is also a modeler, also with a great 'feature list'? FormZ is giving me sticker shock at US$1500 for the modeler alone. I was thinking of buying C4D, so together its a lot. Ooops. I hit the wrong button on the last one. I'd like to start by saying that I admire your work a lot Ernest. I think you are one of the few people who consistantly shows a distinct and recognizable style. It is something I also strive for. I have been a FormZ user for about 6 years now, Cinema 4D for about 5 (yes it's been out that long)and teaching both apps for about 3 yrs. I started on the Mac like most users of these apps but have since switched to a set of PCs due to speed - I'll switch back to Mac when they become fast enough for my 3D work again. Architectural modelling in FormZ is a dream. Its what the program was designed for. It reads and writes DWGs perfectly, works with scale and dimensions just like any CAD app and as the most in depth tool set I have ever seen. Granted over the years many tools have been added to allow other design professionals to use the application and this does cause some initial confusion. Many of the tools in FormZ you will never use for architectural modelling - others you'll wonder how you ever lived without. Like the Terrain tool Take a series of contour lines, highlight them in ascending order and then click on a bounding polygon. Instant terrain model based on actual topography. This is only one of the many tools that I find indespensible. I suggest you grab the new demo and give it a whirl. I'd be happy to answer any questions. In regards to using Cinema 4D as a renderer, which I also do, I think STRAT is the man to speak to. His work is fantastic, as evryone here knows. I think Cinema 4D's testament is the number of users migrating to it for rendering while modeling elsewhere. Some may see this as a sign of weakness. I see it as a strength. Cinema 4D has a great ability to play nicely with just about every 3D and CAD package available. Again there is a demo available and I suggest you take it for a test drive. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STRAT Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 Originally posted by Frosty: In regards to using Cinema 4D as a renderer, which I also do, I think STRAT is the man to speak to. His work is fantastic, as evryone here knows. shucks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackb602 Posted May 15, 2003 Share Posted May 15, 2003 Interesting. I am wondering: why do you choose to model in FormZ when C4D is also a modeler, also with a great 'feature list'? FormZ is giving me sticker shock at US$1500 for the modeler alone. I was thinking of buying C4D, so together its a lot. Ernest, I've just recently (last 2 months) started to work with Cinema 4D; I had used FormZ exclusively for a couple of years before that. Granted, I have much more modeling experience with FormZ than any other app, but I do think it's an incredibly powerful modeler, especially for architecure. It has a vast and powerful toolset which can be intimidating, but once I customised the interface modeling became very quick and intuitive. Unfortunately, the renderer is really difficult to use, and after more than a year of experimenting with it, I still wasn't able to reliably get good results. This is where Cinema 4D came in. I have spent very little time with the Cinema 4D modeler, since I'm already very happy with FormZ, but my impression is that its tools are much more limited. If I found it to be as powerful a modeler as FormZ, I might never look back. On the other hand, if FormZ succeeds in getting one of the high end renderers to create a plugin, that would be pretty tempting too. Hope this helps, Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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