Home design softare advice needed

[CraigB]

Hi, I'm hoping that some of you can point me in the right direction. I've spent a lot of time floundering around the Internet in an attempt to discover some of the answers on my own and soon realized that I needed to ask someone where to even start!

 

I'll begin by saying that I've been using computers for over 25 years (and did software consulting for at least 20 of those) so I'm used to working on one, I like science and math so once I have a context for something I don't mind getting in deep into the details, I used ray tracing several years ago (POV ray) and I've created successful levels for games like Quake and Half Life (in other words I have some idea of 3D modeling, texturing, ray tracing and what it feels like to run through something you've created at a very amateur level).

 

What I am asking for is some general help on concept definitions and what tools I should look for (specific recommendatations greatly appreciated). Although I'm not completey ignorant (just close ;-), I currently do not understand all of the differences between 3D Modeling, 3D Design, CAD, Rendering and Animation. The fact that I find all of these areas very interesting is somewhat besides the point for now, but I'm sure it will help me to learn what I need quickly.

 

Ok, all of that said, I'm looking for a tool to help me design a custom house. The reason I haven't used an off-the-shelf "Home Design" software package to use is due to some of the (shall we say, unique? ) characteristics of the design. Basically most of the structures will be built using domes and arches with the bulk of the building underground. Even the more expensive packages (e.g., Punch! Home Design - Architectual Design 4000) do not seem to be able to handle smooth domes (after researching them I found that some can handle geodesic domes acceptably, but that doesn't help me). I've also noticed that some are limited in the number of levels and struggle with underground designs of any abnormal size.

 

My primary goal is to be able to have domes and arches of differing sizes that I can move around in all three dimensions, above and below ground so I can see how feasible my eccentric ideas are (I should note that the land required will be purchased after I have a basic design so I'm pretty free to experiment quite a bit right now). I would like to be able to fly through the basic, finished product to get a feel for sizes and perspectives. Once I'm satisfied with the basic layout I'd like to send the images and animation to the designers for an initial assessment and further enhancements/corrections. I can see this being an iterative process. Eventually, I'd like to be able to "finish" each room (adding moldings, lighting, furniture, etc.).

 

Sorry for being so long-winded but, unfortunately, I don't yet know enough to ask the best questions! Thanks for bearing with me!

 

Obviously I'd like to know if a reasonably priced software package exists to perform all of what I want above, or if I need to get a combination of packages. Also, are there "beginner" books that you can recommend on the whole subject? Although I need something for the specific reasons mentioned above, I wouldn't be averse to getting a package that will allow me to enjoy other aspects of 3D Modeling/Design/Rendering (like creating digital worlds, designing game levels or designing additional architecture).

 

Feel free to ask me to anything or direct me to another site/forum that may be more suited for my questions.

 

Thank you, I do appreciate the assistance!

 

Craig B.

 

P.S., Computing power should not be an issue in regards to which software package I can run effectively, and the fact that I'm a Ph.D. candidate may allow me to get a more expensive package at a student discount.

[Arnold Sher]

Hi Craig,

 

You are difinetelly in the right place to ask for advice... It is a fairly interesting question that you are asking so i shall try and help in the best way that i can. To start off just to let you know where i am coming from.. I have been in 3d field for the last 10 years or so although making a full time job i.e. having my own business for the last three. I have used most of the 3d software out there that is available ranging from Maya, 3dstudio Max, Viz(a distelled version of Max), Cinema 4d.. Basically the above mentioned software are the "big boys" of the industry.. I am sure i have left out a couple of others and no doubt other forum members will be able to suggest others such as Microstation, however for me personally the choice rests with Studio Max. Not necessarily that it's the best as all the others are pretty capable, it is just something that works for me. There is nothing that you are not able to do with studIO MAX and it is all about creativity and where your mind will take you. Of course as everything it takes time to master and to e it is still a learning curve everyday. When it comes to pricing it is not the cheapest around however your student discount will be able to help you out there. As for the packages that are designed for home users...lol...hmmm...personal opinion...stay away from those..!..nasty pieces of work and waist of money.. Hopefully, in short that helps and best of luck with your project... Let us know how it works out and would love to see it..

 

Regards from Sunny Africa...

[bjornkn]

You should definitely take a look at SketchUp.

It's perfect for that type of design project, where you need to move things around a lot to see how it will work/look.

It will also easily let you fly/walk though your models realtime, or exported as video.

And it's about 1/10th of the price of Max, and takes 1/100th of the time to learn

[Mark M]

Hi Craig,

 

You might want to check out rhino3D (www.rhino3d.com). It’s a really great program and has an easy learning curve. They have a demo you could try out first to see if you like it.

 

Cheers,

Mark

[manta]

Hello,

There are free, capable programs all around us, such as Wings3d a modeler, that some people swear by, there is Blender, a 3d animation program, that I have seen some amazing work come out of, and Yafray, a rendering engine, that can be connected to Blender, I have never used any of the above, but I'm sure they would be fine for any conceptual work you might want to do, and best of all they're all free...

[manta]

Here are some Yafray renderings :

 

http://www.yafray.org/index.php?s=8&PHPSESSID=c331d9f0a1b1cbfae224c332c38e5e64

[CraigB]

Wow! Thanks for all of the replies so far! You've kept me busy for the last few hours researching each package and trying to find definitions for some of the new concepts (like polygon mesh) and abbreviations (like "NURBS").

 

One thing that confused me initially were all the different names like 3D Modeler, CAD, CAM, Renderer, Animator, etc., but I think I've got that part down although there certainly appears to be a lot of overlap.

 

=============================================

 

Provided that I am eligible for the student discount pricing, here's what I've found for the non-free packages mentioned:

 

Discreet 3ds Max 7 - $588

 

Rhino 3D (full bundle) - $429

- Rhino - 3D Modeler

- Flamingo - renderer (picture quality)

- Penguin - renderer (sketch and watercolor quality)

- Bongo - animation

 

SketchUp - $475

 

=============================================

 

Of the above I think I'm most interested in the Rhino suite. That said, I'm VERY impressed with what I've seen with Blender, especially considering it's a free program (as well as Yafray). I noticed several smooth dome structures and arches in their galleries which looked very usable. That may be the place to start and get my feet wet (especially since it looks like Rhino is getting ready to release v4 soon so I should probably wait).

 

Somewhere in the information for Blender I found a reference to Bryce as a renderer which gave me a "DOH!" moment when I realized that right before I packed to move (about 1.5 years ago) I had picked up Bryce 4 to try, packed it and promptly forgot about it (after 20 minutes of looking I found the nice new box still unopened... *sigh* ).

 

This brings me to my next questions:

 

- It looks like most of the 3D Modelers include renderers, but I'm assuming that they are simply not as good or accurate as the standalone packages that focus on rendering. Is this a correct assumption?

 

- For any of you who have used Blender (with or without Yafray), would I want or need any additional programs or plugins to get going?

 

- Is there a standard input/output file format that I should look for and use so that I can take advantage of different programs later? (For example, I've noticed where someone designed something using both AutoCAD and Rhino, can anyone tell me if that was simply because they preferred certain functions in each or if one does things the other can't?)

 

Basically I'd like to get started, but I don't want to get some things finished and then wish I had gotten a different package (obviously not as much of an issue with the free software).

 

Thanks again for the help!

[manta]

1st:

 

It looks like most of the 3D Modelers include renderers, but I'm assuming that they are simply not as good or accurate as the standalone packages that focus on rendering. Is this a correct assumption?

 

Yes, that is ussually the case, however there are exceptions, like XSI has a very good native renderer, MentalRay, and although programs like Max and Maya also come with MentalRay, their incorporation of it is not as good, probably because XSI has had MentalRay for along time...

 

And speaking of XSI, that is a great program for only $495.00, if I wasn't going to use free programs, thats the one I would choose, I've already invested too much in Max at this point.

 

2nd:

For any of you who have used Blender (with or without Yafray), would I want or need any additional programs or plugins to get going?

 

I would look through the blender forums too see whats available, but I think all you would need is Yafray.

 

3rd:

 

Is there a standard input/output file format that I should look for and use so that I can take advantage of different programs later? (For example, I've noticed where someone designed something using both AutoCAD and Rhino, can anyone tell me if that was simply because they preferred certain functions in each or if one does things the other can't?)

 

 

there really isn't any standard format, however FBX is becomming quite popular, in my opinion .obj and .dxf are the most widely accepted, someone can correct me if I'm wrong, there are also programs that can translate files into other files, like deep exploration.

 

Hope that helps...

[manta]

Oh, and one more thing, just to confuse you further, there is IntelliCAD,

which is like a clone of AutoCad, but much cheaper, only $170.00

 

Some people prefer to model in a CAD program because of its accuracy, its all about measurments in CAD, its all about preference...

 

And as for choosing the wrong program, don't worry about it, they can all do the same thing, just in different ways, which ever one you choose and feel comfortable with, will be the right choice...

[alkis t.]

Graig

Dont take the answer below personally, i m just trying to give you something to think about.

If in your post you were to say that you want to do that as an exercise, to learn a 3d package or to get into the field of architectural visualisation, then i wouldnt say the following but rather give my suggestions on a package etc.

 

What you need is an architect not a software package.

a software package is only a tool. its a more complicated and evolved form of a pen or pencil.

 

tThere isnt such thing as a "home design" software .

 

There is a reason why people spend years of training to become able to do what you described in your post.

Rather than spending money on software, write a brief of what you want and try and find some talented porfesionals that can take your vision and make it a reality . In the process they will suggest things and solutions that you wouldnt be able to think of and the end result will be much better.

Kind regards

alkis

[CraigB]

Thanks for all the replies! It took me awhile to get back online, I had my OS disk corrupted itself (turned out to be an old BIOS version that didn't utilize my larger hard drive correctly), but in the middle of reinstalling everything and BEFORE I could get my anti-virus up and running, I picked up a nasty virus and had to start over from scratch...

 

Anyway, I'm not looking to become an architect, though I may get back into gaming and game level design. I definently do not want to give a written overview to an architect to go wild with. I have some very specific designs already and simply want to get them into a 3D modeler that has the ability to "put you in the model" both to determine room sizes (i.e., how they feel to me) and to show the final designers exactly what I'm looking for. In other words, my initial usage of the modeler is to create rough 3D objects and manipulate them in all three dimensions. If I put any furniture in these rooms and areas it will be very minimal at first.

 

For those of you that have used Blender along with the higher-end software packages, how does the actual user interface compare? I flipped through a game design book on Blender that I found at Barnes and Nobles (their user's guide is in the middle of being reprinted) and it looks like they use a lot of specialty keys with their own GUI. While I realize that this may end up being very effective, at first glance it didn't seem very intuitive and certainly doesn't carry the "look and feel" of most programs that are out there that conform to Microsoft's Manual of Style. Heh, you can't beat the price though!