Concerned

[M V]

Am I the only one noticing that there is an influx of new users to this site from India asking for flat out answers to what seem like questions an 8th grader would ask. I am all for this site being a resource for all levels but I am starting to feel a little bit played here. Are we what the rendering sweatshops are having their employees use as part of their 'training'?

 

I know this has come up before, and I have been against it, but I am starting think twice before I answer a question on this site now.

[M V]

I just did a quick search under users. Users from India - 4,400 Users from the US - 250

 

Wow.

[M V]

Just to make my point

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/72160-background-architect-model.html

[/url]

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/72449-need-help-require-tutorial.html

[heni30]

I agree. The site has been flooded by newbie posts. Maybe there should be a newbie section and you wouldn't be able to post to the regular sections until you had 100 posts or some similar setup.

 

There used to be good solid stimulating threads a couple of years ago; I wonder if that can be revived or do sites just follow an inevitable life cycle which peaks and then dies.

[Chris MacDonald]

I wholeheartedly agree. some more examples;

 

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/72450-depth-field.html

 

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/72371-vray-passes.html

 

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/72284-best-vray-exterior-setting-photorealistic-image.html

 

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/72286-vray-intermediate.html

 

http://forums.cgarchitect.com/71867-vray-settings.html

 

My problem with it is that all of the posters appear to want to be spoonfed all of the information, rather than find existing topics, websites, tutorials. There are a dozen new threads for things that have already been discussed a dozen times. Perhaps we as the users should be pointing them more in the direction of the forum search function more often.

Edited December 18, 2012 by Macker

[cg_Butler]

I've not been an avid poster on here for long, maybe a couple of months, but i have been secretly snooping for years. :-) Even I have noticed over the last few weeks more and more of this type of user and question together.

 

I recently took the plunge and decided to be a bit more vocal and I am always keen to answer a question regardless of level or sheer audacity to ask the most ludicrous of questions, but i do draw the line, hence my post on the second link you added. You make a good point though and it's one I'd not really contemplated. India is clearly having an influx of new visualizers and as this is a great resource, they are using it. It's probably as simple as that.

 

I guess

[salvador]

Noticed that too. And anyone can read me posting in the google / forum search direction. That's how I got most of the help I got, searching and reading. There is an incredible amount of info on the internet, so that none should be asking for such basic stuff. Back when I was a real newbie, I knew that for every task at hand, it was buying a good tut or preparing myself for some long hours of reading / testing.

 

I'm always prone to give my two cents, but lately I'm starting to pass by threads like those you linked to.

 

Cheers!

Edited December 18, 2012 by salvador

[M V]

Seems super fishy to me that a lot (if not all) of these posts are from India.

[Nic H]

Its not really got much to do with being from India to be honest.

 

Its more about the massive influx of people not bothering to try before asking stupid questions or asking such broad questions it makes me want turn off my screens.

 

Just don't reply or offer offer wrong advice imo. It does kind of undermine everything

[Justin Hunt]

I agree with nicnic, Over the years the are waves of newbies who then progress on. In some cases it follows the school year, ie there is an influx of simple questions at the start and end of each semester.

 

Often its easier to post a question before working it out for yourself.

 

So No I dont think its any sort of conspiracy or any need to start fear mongering, you just need to decide if you want to answer or not.

 

jhv

[M V]

Guess its just the fear mongering conspiracy theorist in me. Just odd that 5 posts in a row are from Mumbai and are just odd questions like, "should I use a bump map?" Are you kidding? This isn't an influx of newbies, this is an influx of people that have zero knowledge of 3D, like some sweatshop just mass hired a bunch of people and told them to learn how to model and render by next week.

[Jason Matthews]

Well I think it may also be from just sheer laziness. Posts coming from India do not bother me. This is a global discussion board and I treat it as that. Maybe we just ignore the threads that are from people (from all countries) who are too lazy to use the search function. That said, I would rather do a google search and skim through articles rather than formulate a well thought out explanation of the issue just to post on the forums.

 

Merry Christmas everyone!

[Scott Schroeder]

It's just an influx of people into this industry. Like it or not, this industry is no longer considered specialized with the advancement of technology and the global market.

 

Many new people, and it's more likely a sign of the times, want instant spoon fed knowledge. No one wants to research and, God forbid, learn on their own anymore. If it's a dumb question, I usually take the time to answer it with a link to "Let me Google that for you." I take more of an issue with when these questions get answered and either the OP never comes back. Perhaps the forums can just block any post that has "Help me plz" in it. Honestly, that pisses me off more than the dumb question. If you can't take the time to spell please, I don't have time to Google that for you.

 

I'm not losing sleep over trying to compete with a bunch of goons who don't understand 3D, bump maps, or how to use Google.

[Jeff Mottle]

The number of people from various countries by count is not a valid statistic as it only records those who selected a country in their profile after registering. Many people register and don't complete their profile, so its not the full picture. I find people from US and Europe tend to be highly protective of their name and location. I get many requests to have accounts deleted when *shutter* they learn their name will actually be posted online with their post. Depending on my mood and time available I may or may not as it's clearly posted in the forum rules.

 

Regardless, the life of a forum is entirely dictated by those who participate. Unfortunately the vast majority of the people who have been in the industry for a long time tend to post the least, despite the different mood and professionalism they would bring to the forums.

 

I'm all ears if you guys would like to see some changes.

[Chris MacDonald]

Short of banning people for such things, I don't think there's anything much you can do. I'm not suggesting banning either, that would be silly. I think we perhaps need to encourage a culture of "forum search, or nobody will help". I used to be on a huge music forum where the number of repeated posts irritated people no end; but eventually the culture of replying with "use the damn forum search" paid dividends and the number of duplicate posts went down.

 

I have no quarrel with helping people out with tricky problems, in fact I revel in the opportunity to help someone solve something; it's the mundane things have have been covered countless times on this forum, blogs, other forums, tutorial websites and such that really irk me. Laziness, essentially.

[cg_Butler]

Perhaps there's scope for a baseball type "thumbs up" or "thumbs down" option for every user three strikes and out out. That way, people who post relevant, well thought out answers get rewarded with a thumbs up. (That in turn might help to select future moderators etc) and those with a thumbs down can have the moderators beady eyes gazing upon them with the knowledge that if they continue to be naughty, after a warning or two, they will be banned. I appreciate they can probably just re-register with a different email address and name but it might help a little bit!

[Jeff Mottle]

Perhaps there's scope for a baseball type "thumbs up" or "thumbs down" option for every user three strikes and out out. That way, people who post relevant, well thought out answers get rewarded with a thumbs up. (That in turn might help to select future moderators etc) and those with a thumbs down can have the moderators beady eyes gazing upon them with the knowledge that if they continue to be naughty, after a warning or two, they will be banned. I appreciate they can probably just re-register with a different email address and name but it might help a little bit!

 

If we can avoid it, I'd rather not start banning people for being lazy. If we see something that's been answered before, it's going to be better to just post "This topic has been discussed before, please use the search feature to try to find the answer, or post back here if you still can't find anything"

 

Also if you want the forums to take on a new mood, subject matter coverage, let me know what you'd rather see being discussed and maybe there is something I can do to help move it in that direction.

[laszloadrian]

I say there should be no change to the forum. If you think the question is stupid, or has been discussed, do not reply. He can wait for an answer or use use Google. Easy.

 

Now, if you are feeling treathend by "sweatshops" that is another discussion.

[salvador]

Maybe a little redundant, but I'm just thinking; written and video tutorials are far more explanatory than a forum reply, elaborated as it may be; at least for the general issues. This forum, indeed used to take things to the next level (still does) and that's what's interesting and inspiring to me. I subscribe to threads just because they are about something interesting I don't know and I might need to know in the future.

 

Maybe these guys truly think that doing good CG is just a few clicks away and the want it the express way. I know it's not, most of us do. I, for one, support the "use the search tool" behavior.

 

Happy Holidays to all! (and no, the Mayas didn't say the world will end tomorrow )

[hockley91]

I pretty much Google everything and Youtube what I need to do. If I need a script, I go to Scriptspot. If I need a texture, I usually make it myself or grab an image from Google and modify it. I of course also come here to answer questions, give my two cents on a subject and of course get help. Back in the early 2000's, I got a HUGE wealth of help from all you guys and it was and still is appreciated and I try to do the same to those that truly need advice and help.

 

I think we've all come across some bad topics and questions. I typically just move on to the next topic if it doesn't interest me.

[Justin Hunt]

I really enjoy tutorials or links to tutorials. Maybe the tutorial forum needs more population.

[Chris MacDonald]

Yeah, the tutorials here are excellent. Perhaps a series on 3d basics 101, then render engine basics 101; an all encompassing series that would be just enough to give beginners a proper insight into good working practices and so on. I know the subjects have been covered numerous times but it would be good if we had it all covered in one section.

 

For example the rendering section might comprise of;

 

-render theory, what it is and why we do it.

-render engines, biased, unbiased, plugin or standalone, comparison chart.

-texturing (also covered in modelling 101, perhaps); differences between diffuse, reflection, specular, bump & displacement. Procedural maps, etc.

-Render setups/GI/Colour mapping & gamma.

-Output formats.

 

Just an idea that might deflect a lot of the newbie questions.

[Devin Johnston]

I think if you start banning people for asking stupid questions you're going to kill participation. It's a fact that there will always be noobs in this field it just needs to be communicated to them to do a search before asking that question. I'm much more concerned about sweetshops and outsourcing but that topic has also been covered many times with no consensus on what should be done.

[carlotristan3d]

convenience is the byproduct of the internet, it's more convenient to ask than to search. how about requiring users certain number of posts before allowing them to start threads. we'll probably get a lot of nice, good, wow, repeat rinse comments but we already have that.

[Nils Norgren]

One quick comment from a longtime member, but fairly infrequent poster. I would agree that there will always be the new user asking what would be consider as naive posts, and that should be expected. One possible response that would marry the two suspicions, (Simply a new user, or help desk for a cut rate shops in Asia), would be to ask for more detail about the user themselves, before engaging in discussion.

 

Knowing their circumstances might make one more (or less) likely to want to help.

 

-Nils