Closed Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 30
Like Tree2Likes

Thread: Help with Workstation build!!!

  1. #1
    Junior Member kalisafielding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10

    Name
    Kalisa Fielding
    Forum Username
    kalisafielding

    United States

    Red face Help with Workstation build!!!

    I've seen a few other threads with this same topic, but I figured it would be easier to make my own! I am going to be using mostly 3d programs like maya, 3ds max, zbrush and than a lot of photoshop. (mild gaming would be nice too...like sims 4, age of empires...nothing to hardcore for this computer) I'd like to keep my build under 3K, ideally less but if it's going to be a much better build I'm willing to spend a little bit more.

    I keep going back and forth on the type of build I want, so to start off I need to finally make a decision on my CPU:

    i7-3930k(or wait for the i7-4940k) or go the xeon route (like the xeon e5-1650 or a dual-xeon).

    as well as my GPU: Quadro k4000 or gtx 780 or firepro w7000

    Once I get these figured out I have a basic idea for the rest of the parts (I'm sure I'll still need help though!), but these are mainly the ones I can not for the life of me decide on!

  2. #2
    Junior Member kalisafielding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10

    Name
    Kalisa Fielding
    Forum Username
    kalisafielding

    United States


  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    los angeles
    Posts
    107

    Name
    j d
    Forum Username
    unrinoceronte

    United States

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Well i am no expert, but first let me say there is no 4940k, it is 4930K...Anyways it seems that for your budget ($3000) you can go for the 3930k/4930k route. BUT, if altough the 4930k seems to be just a few days or weeks to start sales, i think there was an advice from some experts here at CGarchitect, that the Motherboard "support" for this new Ivy Bridge-E platform (4930k) will not be maturely develop yet... I guess it will take a few months to get some good certified 4930k Mobos... If i am not mistaken you can use the old x79 chip Mobos, which are compatible, but i think is better to have a good certified 4930k mobo.

    Take a look at this recent article: http://uk.hardware.info/reviews/4761...2nm-powerhouse

    Having said that, since $3000 it some good money, it makes sense to wait a few months for the new 4930k instead of buying the almost 2 year old 3930k (but only you can tell if you can wait). If you do, you will get a slight upgrade in rendering speed (10% approx) from the 3930k, but quite a better energy consumption (around 40W less consumption), besides being a new technology (22nm, etc etc).

    If you CAN NOT wait, my recommendation is go for the 3930k (higher overall price with all the components compared to the 4770k), or go with a very good option, not so fast, but way more cheaper: i7 4770K (Haswell) which just came out a few months ago, is new technology and is the best for the price range of Under $1500 (for whole components with budget GPU: Quadro K600, and 16 or 32 gigs of ram). Or for under $2000, the same 4770k, but with a better GPU, like the Quadro k2000 or even perhaps the Quadro K4000...

    In my case, 1 and 1/2 months ago i bought a 4770k workstation and i built it myself for under $1300 with the Quadro K600 GPU, 16 Gigs Ram, and 1 TB HDD. At the beginning of my research I was in need of a very powerfull workstation with a budget of $3000 to $4000, but then i realized that all the new technology for a workstation with this budget was going to be available and mature until the last quarter of 2013, so instead i decided to just spend a lot less with a 4770K and have a TEMPORARY Workstation, and that then on December 2013 i would buy the really Horsepower Workstation (4930k or perhaps 2x xeon) to replace the 4770k as my main workstation, and use the 4770k workstation as a rendering node, or as a BACKUP workstation....

    Other option you have is to Build a 4770k Workstation for $1500 to $2000, and then build 1 or 2 cheap i7 4770 RENDERING NODES on mini itx Cases. Perhaps they can cost you around $700 each. Take a look at this threads:
    http://forums.cgarchitect.com/73773-...nder-node.html

    http://forums.cgarchitect.com/74013-...-write-up.html

    For your GPU decision, there is plenty of threads here talking about the options you have... As a summary, if i am not mistaken, i could say that the conclusions where:
    Quadro K4000 : BEST for Viewport Performance on 3D - Open GL programs (bad for gaming)
    Gtx 780: Best for GPU rendering on Vray (and for gaming). Mediocre Viewport Performance on 3D programs.

    About Xeons and FirePro... i know nothing!.

    Good luck, and i hope you can get some better an educated advice than mine...

  4. #4
    Junior Member kalisafielding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10

    Name
    Kalisa Fielding
    Forum Username
    kalisafielding

    United States

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Thank you so much Javier! haha, yes I did mean the i7-4930k. I didn't realize the mobo's wouldn't be certified for it right away, so that does kind of change things. I like the idea of having the newer CPU, but now I'm not sure. I would like to do this build as soon as I can, as it's for my last class in school and I want to be able to have a great & reliable rendering machine while finishing my portfolio.

    I've heard the firepro w7000 in is on par with the quadro k4000, but not as reliable. It is better for gaming though than the quadro from what I've read so far. But I feel like more people go with nvidia over firepro.

    I keep hearing various things about using an i7 over a xeon (and vice-versa) in a workstation, so it's just a lot of information to take in as this is my first build ever. I wonder why they don't have a mobo available at the release of the i7-4930k....

  5. #5
    Veteran Member dtolios's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Los Angeles (imported)
    Posts
    1,290

    Name
    Dimitris Tolios
    Forum Username
    dtolios

    Greece

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Remember, that "many cores" in mainstream CG creation are used almost exclusively when rendering (stills/video), developing camera RAWs/applying certain PS filters and transcoding video.

    A 4770K will be faster than a 4930K (both @ stock and clock per clock when overclocked) for most stuff outside the processes above.
    Depending on your workflow, it might be:
    Single threaded heavy: lots of Revit / CAD / Sketchup / 3DS / Maya / C4D modelling
    Heavily threaded: lots of renderings, lots of video transcoding. For the 1st part we are talking about a rendering node.

    And that is the curse of the 2P systems: when rendering, the many cores/threads work great. 2P systems are the ideal rendering nodes.

    But when it comes to modelling, you have all but a couple of cores idling, and all this "horsepower" goes to waste.
    Xeons are forced to have low clocks to accommodate all these cores in a "manageable" thermal package (i.e. something that you can cool efficiently in a server room environment where 100s or 1000s of CPUs might be pumping out heat through small 2U or smaller racks) and are far from optimized for "workstations" that might have a whole full ATX tower and large coolers dedicated to cool them down.

    Technically, a $2000 8 and soon 12 core Xeon or a 2P system with two of those, is no better for modelling and than a faster clocked, $120 Haswell i3 dual core CPU.

    So, although daydreaming those fancy Xeons based on "number of cores" is easily understandable, few people can make use of them in ways that would make a 2P workstation better overall than a fast Quad i7 with decent GPU and RAM specs, along with a number of simpler render nodes that allow you to work faster, more efficiently and with better redundancy than placing all your money on a single box.

    For school work, stay away from W7000/K4000, Mac Pros and all these fancy components. You can never have a return of investment on those, and i highly doubt that you will be using them to their full potential anyways. Of course those are better, but thinking "thinner" hardware, will allow you to invent workflow work-arounds that will make you work more efficiently and effectively regardless of hardware - as long as you are meeting a certain minimum - ofc I wouldn't suggest anyone working with a ultrabook and IGP graphics, but if you "spoil" yourself thinking that you can just buy your way into complex models, you will soon be disappointed by the thinks you assume should work "magically", but won't, regardless of you using a k4000 or a k6000, a 2P or a whole render farm.
    Forgive my rants - I can be laconic in Greek if you prefer.
    PCFoo.com // DIY PC Resource Site

  6. #6
    Junior Member kalisafielding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10

    Name
    Kalisa Fielding
    Forum Username
    kalisafielding

    United States

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    That is so unbelievably helpful! I have had a few people tell me the xeon/quadro k4000 is the only way to get a proper workstation. I am so new at this stuff that it's hard to research it all, but I really appreciate everything you said!

    SO, what would you suggest as far as the GPU goes? And you think the 4770k>4930k? I do want it to be a nice build that is easily upgradeable later down the road if need be, but it's by and far not a computer that I'm doing work for clients yet.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    los angeles
    Posts
    107

    Name
    j d
    Forum Username
    unrinoceronte

    United States

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Kalisa, without the permission of Dimitris, i will take the liberty of posting his excellent resourcefull website where he has recommendations for several "types" of computer configurations, from Basic, to Pro. Take a look at it, you will find everything you need, and if you want to change something, you have the base for most of the configuration components chosen in a logical way.

    Go here, and select SYSTEM CONFIGURATIONS/WORKSTATIONS : http://pcfoo.com/
    You might be interested in his recommendations for MID RANGE and PRO.

    Good luck

  8. #8
    Veteran Member dtolios's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Los Angeles (imported)
    Posts
    1,290

    Name
    Dimitris Tolios
    Forum Username
    dtolios

    Greece

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Depending on the programs you are using, I would say either a Quadro K2000, or a GTX 760 should work fine.
    Javier ended up getting a K600 and he still can work on stuff (I presume).

    GTX cards work fine with latest Autodesk DirectX viewports, like 3DS, Revit and ACAD.

    Quadros (and Firepros) are still "better" in some ways, but again, having a quadro won't help you become better...especially in those programs.

    Quadros (and Firepros) are vastly better in OpenGL based viewports, like Maya, C4D, Solidworks, Siemens NX etc.

    Also better in Sketchup, but the complexity in Sketchup is usually not that crazy, plus sketchup has a relatively intelligent image degrading algorithm that works great when organizing your model with blocks/components. Sketchup is more CPU limited (only uses 1x core of course, not to be mistaken for plugins like VRay for Sketchup that use all available) than GPU limited.

    Similarly, Revit is also far more CPU/RAM/SSD or HDD limited than GPU limited (to my experience).

    For all the above, your mileage may vary, as everything is linked to scene complexity - something that is subjective...you might feel that you scene is "amazingly complex, god I need a Quadro K4000", when some people in this forums might have been working on that kind of complexities 10 years ago in Pentium IIIs. Or what you think mundane and simple, might be what I consider "impossibly" complex. Don't trust anyone saying "you need X to run 3DS", unless there is a point of reference - i.e. end result images, polygon counts, total texture sizes etc.

    Always keep in mind the masterpieces of CG created over the last 10 years, and that every 2 years you get "twice" the processing power.
    I.e. some people were doing stuff that would be considered far above average today, using 5% the CPU power a modern i7 has. The only thing that changed really, is that after you've modeled the thing and did the lighting setup, you can "orbit" around it much faster with your modern GPU, and render it 20 times faster with your modern CPU (or use much finer settings). The creative process is not revolutionized by machines, but by users. You cannot buy your way into it, takes patience and passion above $$.

    Yes, the 4770K is faster than the 3930K / 4390K for anything you do before you hit the "render" button.
    All these rants and descriptive crap of posts I write, are exactly cause you cannot just say "4770 > 4390" and walk away. It is situational, you cannot dismiss either as "inferior"...there are many reasons why the 6-core is better, and many reasons it is not.

    If you go 4390K way, there is no "upgrade path" for the future - unless you mean adding more than 32GB of RAM (4770K is limited to 32GB, s2011 CPUs can go 64GB with regular UDIMMs). There won't be another compatible X79 s2011 generation after the 49xx.
    GPUs will work just fine with either platform. Again, for single or 2x GPUs, the Z87/4770K platform will be slightly faster than the X79/4930K, much like the Z77/3770K was faster than the X79/3930K.

    All those differences are small to untraceable for most users, but the fact that a Quad core can be faster than a Hex-core due to architecture and clock advantages still stand: it is only during heavily threaded processes that the extra 2 cores come into the scene to save the day for the 4930K. If that's not part of your workflow "enough", you've might end up paying $300-400 extra over a Z87/4770K combo under the illusion that "since it is a hex-core, it is definitely faster".
    Forgive my rants - I can be laconic in Greek if you prefer.
    PCFoo.com // DIY PC Resource Site

  9. #9
    Junior Member kalisafielding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10

    Name
    Kalisa Fielding
    Forum Username
    kalisafielding

    United States

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Wow, yea that website is wayyyy too helpful! So awesome. Thanks so much for posting that

  10. #10
    Junior Member kalisafielding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10

    Name
    Kalisa Fielding
    Forum Username
    kalisafielding

    United States

    Default Re: Help with Workstation build!!!

    Dimitris- You sir, know your stuff! Thank you so very much.

    My system I have now that I have been using for maya has a Intel Q6600, with 4GB of RAM and a geforce gtx 260. It has been fine for learning the programs, I just want something a bit better... It's starting to feel quite slow!

Closed Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

     

Similar Threads

  1. Workstation build I7 or Xeon?
    By Adam Glover in forum Hardware and Technical Discussions
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: August 27th, 2011, 05:32 PM
  2. Critique new workstation build
    By CGstorm in forum Hardware and Technical Discussions
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: August 25th, 2010, 04:21 PM
  3. Build my own workstation?
    By markf in forum Hardware and Technical Discussions
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: July 24th, 2003, 08:53 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts