Freelance Rendering, How much to charge?

[filiproberto]

Ok guys let's post images and prices

 

I sold this image for 1000€ to a large company in France:

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]52495[/ATTACH]

 

Image delivered in 3500 pixels wide, high quality V-Ray render (licence bought, thanks for asking).

 

I can't remember how long I spent on this image and I'm not very good at keeping track of time ::: but let's say I spent 3 to 4 days (8 hours a day) including communication with the client.

 

I consider that this amount of money, for this amount of time, for this product, is right for me and for the client.

 

What do you think about the price, the time spent, the image?

 

Please post your images and corresponding prices so we can really talk

 

I can get pretty close to same results with UE4 in the same amount of time and can give the client the real time app so he can HighResScreenshot his unlimited number of renders from all angles if he needs an image. Would do it for 1000-1500 euros, yet I am struggling to find clients.

 

Feel free to contact me if you guys know clients interested in real time and want to be the middleman (or whatever we can work out).

 

P.S - no disrespect on your work, I like it.

[oliviecharbonneau]

Hi Filip that is very interesting and realtime is definitely a very worthy approach!

 

In that case the client needed only 1 shot in 3,5k for print so not the best case scenario for realtime, but for sure in other cases it would be great to say the least.

 

Good luck finding clients man, it is for sure not the easiest and most enjoyable part of our job :::

[saiyukishirou]

I can get pretty close to same results with UE4 in the same amount of time and can give the client the real time app so he can HighResScreenshot his unlimited number of renders from all angles if he needs an image. Would do it for 1000-1500 euros, yet I am struggling to find clients.

 

Feel free to contact me if you guys know clients interested in real time and want to be the middleman (or whatever we can work out).

 

P.S - no disrespect on your work, I like it.

 

 

That is a super good deal if you ask me.. hahaha

I currently work in indonesia and most people startled when i asked for a 200 USD / image in 5k resolution

 

so right now my fee is ranging from 40-200 USD mostly below 80USD /images. and i'm already having trouble finding client who is willing to pay such amount. Since my competitors are willing to get lower than that..

 

this is my online porto http://www.m-jay.com

as probably since i use Sketchup for all images done, that justifies the price, or not?

I dont know.

I dont have any degree, I've been applying to big render studios but seems haven't got any luck.

Edited January 21, 2015 by saiyukishirou

[oliviecharbonneau]

Hi Misandi thanks for sharing your images and prices. Your images are way more than good enought for the price you sell them, but obviously in Indo the prices are crazy low anyways... Good luck for the future!

 

Please anybody else willing to post an image with its price?

 

An example from a studio would be interesting to compare with freelance pricing.

Edited January 21, 2015 by oliviecharbonneau

[ryannelson]

I did one recently for $1500 CDN for 4 images + modelling. Only one was well composited, the others were "quick" Check out my gallery for the house image. I think it was low but I'm just starting to freelance in the evenings. I have a project I'm working on now but not done yet, I'll post that once it's done. I still have a LOT of learning to do so I'm trying to find a balance ($$$) between not wasting my time and energy, and delivering a top notch product.

[philippelamoureux]

It's not all about the price Misandi. Doing business with someone 10 000 km away from you isn't the same as doing business with someone you can meet in person in your town!!! That is probably why, even with low prices, you won't find many clients in the Occident. There are no way we can compete with 40-200$ renderings. Maybe it's viable in your market tho!

 

Also, concerning ue4. For the case of the paint store renderings. There is really no need for the client to make 56 screenshots of that kind of ''architecture''. It's a very basic paint store and I doubt you can print a ue4 screenshot and get something decent. Ue4 is really made for realtime. check out this article Filip, these guys are from my town. IMO, if you want a chance to make money with ue4, this is the only viable way to do it as of now. I might be wrong tho!

Edited January 22, 2015 by philippelamoureux

[philippelamoureux]

I did one recently for $1500 CDN for 4 images + modelling. Only one was well composited, the others were "quick" Check out my gallery for the house image. I think it was low but I'm just starting to freelance in the evenings. I have a project I'm working on now but not done yet, I'll post that once it's done. I still have a LOT of learning to do so I'm trying to find a balance ($$$) between not wasting my time and energy, and delivering a top notch product.

 

Ryan can you link us your work, I can't find it in the gallery :-( You seem to price your images way too low, I'd like to see what you do. Thanks!

[ryannelson]

Yeah I know it was really low. The budget was quite low for the project and the client assured me there would be more work. I decided to compromise based on my experience level and the potential (not holding my breath on that). I'd like to be in the $2000/image range, which is about a week of work. There's a broad range of hourly charge and I think it's better to go per image rather than hourly to keep it consistent and manage expectations. Here's a link to my portfolio on cgarchitect thus far: http://www.cgarchitect.com/members/view/ryannelson

 

Even from the house I did, I have come a LONG way. I'm still on the steep upward climb of the learning curve, I'm having a blast!

[heni30]

Definitely shows potential but if you don't up your prices soon you'll be The Hungry Arch-viz Artist working for The Hungry Architect.

Edited January 22, 2015 by heni30

[ryannelson]

Definitely shows potential but if you don't up your prices soon you'll be The Hungry Arch-viz Artist working for The Hungry Architect.

 

haha thanks! That or The Going Hungry Architect!

[saiyukishirou]

It's not all about the price Misandi. Doing business with someone 10 000 km away from you isn't the same as doing business with someone you can meet in person in your town!!! That is probably why, even with low prices, you won't find many clients in the Occident. There are no way we can compete with 40-200$ renderings. Maybe it's viable in your market tho!

 

Also, concerning ue4. For the case of the paint store renderings. There is really no need for the client to make 56 screenshots of that kind of ''architecture''. It's a very basic paint store and I doubt you can print a ue4 screenshot and get something decent. Ue4 is really made for realtime. check out this article Filip, these guys are from my town. IMO, if you want a chance to make money with ue4, this is the only viable way to do it as of now. I might be wrong tho!

 

actually those prices are for local indonesian market and my networks are mostly friends.

I haven't got any work from the Occident, and i've been applying to big render studios there, because i'd like to work in an healthier environment.

However Seems like they are all require a bachelor degree, it is very difficult to get out of this hole ( shitty market in my country) for a self taught like me.

and thanks, yeah i got the idea of clients prefer doing business with someone closer to them .

what really sad is big developers here prefer to pay some studios in China to have the prestige label of "hiring big foreign consultant"

for example i met some clients the first question was always "where did u graduate from?" i told them i'm a self taught, then i didnt get the job, and months later i saw the projects rendered by some studio in China with 5 times the price.

[Chris MacDonald]

I get charged out at ~£50 an hour (depends who, and what for. Sometimes costs more, sometimes costs less), so for a days work you're looking at ~£375. But this is at a large architectural firm, not small/freelance studio.

Edited January 26, 2015 by Macker

[oliviecharbonneau]

Hello Chris, thanks for sharing this UK info: in France a proper archviz studio would sell its services for the exact same amount of 500€ a day (a proper company with management and specialized employees).

 

Things obviously get a lot less clear about freelance prices: in France it would go anywhere from 100€ a day (or less sometimes!) to 300€ a day (possibly more in some cases like urgent desperate project).

 

Also I observed something about my own business : I make a lot more money "per hour" doing motion graphics (mix of 3d and photo/video/graphics) than doing full animated 3d (because full CG is always a long and complicated process) and in the end the client doesn't care about the technical complexity : he only cares about the benefit he's going to have out of the final "communication tool".

Edited January 26, 2015 by oliviecharbonneau

[nikitashestakov]

hello guys!

i was wondering the same question and got quite amazed by the prices which are currently on the market! Seems that I was charging way too low, though I have a bit different style - I don't really chase photorealism.

I'm very much interested in your opinion how much this type of imagery might cost

[oliviecharbonneau]

In France I would say around 1.500€ for a freelance would be fair for both parties.

Around twice that amount for a company (3d studio or communication agency).

Obviously it can be a lot more in some cases ; if the client is a large developer for example.

It depends a lot since pricing is a bet on the 3d provider side (especialy with new clients) and a call/bargain on the client side.

[himanshuchoudhary]

WOW!

 

These prices are driving me crazy! since i started reading each and every post, i am feeling that my current employer is paying me waay too less in regards to the work i am producing for him.

 

Here is what i get paid

225czk/hour (before taxes), which after the tax deduction, comes to around 7usd per hour.

A standard month of work will have about 180 working hours.

 

Now, i have no clue what my boss charges for each render, but i suppsoe it is in the same league as the prices mentioned ( 400-700euros/render). You can have a look at the company i work for here to get an idea of the quality of work produced.

 

http://www.visualarch.eu

 

All you experienced people, do let me know what is good for me. I have started freelancing on the side, but dont have too much time after the office. The only issue here being that i am from India, and have an employee permit visa to work in CZ.

Should i stick with the job, or try to look for some other possibilities?

[oliviecharbonneau]

It's always tempting to think we'r not paid enought but it is also very comfortable to be an employee versus being a freelance.

As a freelance you'll have to make sure you find enought projects/clients to make a living and you'll have to do yourself all the supporting tasks like accounting, paperwork, IT maintenance and you'll have charges like IT equipment, content/software, social stuff to pay for and more taxes, etc.

Freelancing is definitly a good thing for some but it is a challenge (I am a freelance now and I like it a lot that way).

 

FYI : I owned a 3d studio a few years ago (3 to 5 employess) and I can tell you that when the employees think they are not paid well enought you, as the manager, have a good sad laught because you see all the costs / expanses and in the end you don't even pay yourself lol, but the employees still think they don't get paid enought obviously...

 

Anyways have a talk with you boss to try to know more about your company but you could be surprised... and from that you can ask for a raise, or be happy with what you have, or decide to leave the company because you got screwed all along

In any case if you feel something is wrong go talk with your boss!

Edited February 2, 2015 by oliviecharbonneau

[heni30]

Are you doing the entire rendering for him - or just a part of the process? If it's nuts and bolts I would say minimum $15 -$20 an hour. If it's the artistic end of things, a minimum of $20-25 an hour. If you freelance and can efficiently produce those images on your own, $50 an hour.

 

Freelance rate would be for high quality, professional, reliable service.

 

But once again - it depends on what the market is like. If you demand more and someone will step right in for what you got before you are in a difficult situation.

 

But from your client list I would guess some of the renderings are in the $4000 - $5000 range.

Edited February 2, 2015 by heni30

[himanshuchoudhary]

Fair enough Olivier,

Thanks for the advice. My only issue would be the amount of work i produce v/s the money i am getting paid (usually i come up with 15-20 renders each month)

I shall have a discussion with them soon

 

Cheers!

[himanshuchoudhary]

Are you doing the entire rendering for him - or just a part of the process?

 

I usually do almost all of the process. I was anyway getting much less than some other professions, for example, a friend who is a tour guide gets more than me for per hour rate. So does a friend who works as a sales person in a crystal glass store.

[oliviecharbonneau]

Yes 15-20 renders a month is quite a lot and definitely this has a good market value compared to "7 usd per hour x 180 working hours = 1260 USD". Your company must make good margins out of your work, or maybe they sell out their services to secure the projects/clients.

 

Also I understand that in eastern Europe there are a lot of talented 3d people and at the same time the prices are pretty low for high quality renders, so there is that to take into consideration. You'r maybe not in the best market for 3d salary/business.

 

Let us know what your boss told you about that

Edited February 2, 2015 by oliviecharbonneau

[philippelamoureux]

I usually do almost all of the process. I was anyway getting much less than some other professions, for example, a friend who is a tour guide gets more than me for per hour rate. So does a friend who works as a sales person in a crystal glass store.

 

Looking at the work your compagny is making, If I was working in Canada I would hope for at least 25$/hour (CAD) for the kind of imagery I see on the website. 7$ for that quality (depends on your market I guess) seems too low to me! I see you are working in Eastern Europe...but AFIAK Juraj Talcik too, and I'm pretty damn sure he wouldn't (and his employee if he have some) even start his pc for 7$/hour. If your boss sells these renders at a ''fair'' price he makes a lot of profit I bet!

[RyderSK]

I see you are working in Eastern Europe...but AFIAK Juraj Talcik too

 

:- D

 

While I wholeheartedly (and unpatriotically) believe my country of origin (but in big extension, same for Czech republic where Himanshu now resides, and I had resided for 3 years) belongs to 'Eastern Europe' mentally (in the most negative way possible), geographically and most importantly, market-wise, it's not there.

 

Too many concepts are fussed and mentioned above, to extremely confusing melange. What someones boss makes, is irrelevant in capitalist society and doesn't influence wage, which is purely agreement between employer and employee. You get what you agree to. While you may dictate your conditions based on worth of your work, it will always be compared to median income in your local area (Prague) and industry (Visualization, in contrary to popular opinion and wishes, is not technical field, but creative arts, and therefore falls in lower income bracket ).

 

The wage for 3D artists around Prague is indeed between 1200 to 2000 euros gross monthly depending on their worth and expertise. Indie game studios pay the least, archviz pays the smaller middle, top VFX houses like NoEmotion/Marek Denko pays the highest.

 

As a freelancer or studio owner, you get what you're able to get, it's not hard to average out above 100 euros/hour, even within Eastern Europe ;- ) In ever increasing global market, while few can dictate prices like top agencies in London/NYC, the rest is spread quite evenly on gaussian price curve, and based on your merit and influence, not you geographical location. Where I live doesn't matter, what my work is worth to client is.

 

Still, there is a concept of "fair-wage" (without political implication, just general, 'nice-guy' behaviour), and therefore I don't pay that low despite the fact I could. I still remember my horrible week in that shitty studio of yours :- ) Changed my outlook on life and career. I can now guarantee, my employees/partners (which I have few, ranging from in-office to home office based, again, modern structure, do what suits you best) get much better, ethical and financially viable options. Unlike your pitiful bosses ;- )

 

Anyway, price of work per marketing/competition image is between 600 to 6000 euros most commonly today (with average time of one week worth of time for it). Some of the most admired EU studios are in middle of this range, rather than at upper fringes. The price, is again, mostly dictated by merit (visual quality and service offered) and influence (brand worth, market prestige), not by your location. No one...no one cares you live in Luxembourg or Swiss, or that Canada has high minimal wage. To me, most people are simply asking for pipe-dream. You get paid highly when you're good and ask for it, not because you believe you should be. Simple enough concept oblivious to many.

[Hassan Jaber]

this is one really interesting topic we all struggle when it comes to having paid well according to the work u do , what makes me frustrated is when you show the good high quality you can offer but still clients tries to trick you down. im always wondering is it better to have standard prices for what you offer? do we charge per shot , per space, what would be an average good price ?? i usually charge per project ? coz most of the times i do the whole model , i find it ridiculous to just model one corner unless the client is so specific in what he wants.

 

i work in dubai market and sadly there many low quality works here and it low priced . which affects you when asking for good prices?! i was wondering what would i must charge as a freelancer for some works i do. ? https://www.behance.net/gallery/22655815/Living-Room-in-winter-

 

im starting to draw a range between 600-2000 $ per shot ? but still i find it low for the quality and dedication i can provide ? advice's will be appreciated you can find my work here

 

this is one important subject lets make it worth for all thx..

Edited February 3, 2015 by Hassan Jaber

[Hassan Jaber]

This price survey was done by cg architect . i believe since 2 years . do you think it really works out ?