peter mayer Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Hi guys I`ve been reading this thread, very helpful but still I must ask. I have a project that requires 2 external renders and 3 interiors in two color schemes (total 6) plus same interiors in 360 QTVR, the project is for a Canadian client. I`ve never worked for a Canadian client and I was wondering if I should charge per hour or per render? Model is supplied by the client but no landscaping or furniture. That has to be done by me. I am preparing to quote 25 CAD/hour or 500-600 CAD per render. Check out my work here, http://on.be.net/1EIqtrQ Any response, much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter mayer Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Hi everyone, I read most of the posts here and it`s very helpful. I do have to ask though. I have a job request from Canada, a country which I never worked for previously and I would like to know how should I charge the job? They are a big company in western Canada. They require 1 aerial external, 1 external low shot, 3 interior shots at 5000px wide and another 3 in different color scheme of the same. Plus 3 360 degree QTVR shots. Furniture and interior stuff has to be modeled by yours truly. They supplied CAD files and Revit file of the building. If you want to see my quality, check out my portfolio to have an idea http://petermayer1981.wix.com/portfolio Thanks a bunch!! Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frog_a_lot Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 I think I saw Thomas Keller flipping off Burger King once. Can me make this the oath of CGArchitect? In 13 pages of responses, this is the one that matters the most. I disagree.. i think it is our job to try to improve the industry and fix some of these 'issues' if we can.. rather than just saying "It doesn't effect me at this exact moment so i dont care" and hiding your head in the sand.. If the people in the industry aren't going to look out for the industry.. who will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryannelson Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Hi everyone, I read most of the posts here and it`s very helpful. I do have to ask though. I have a job request from Canada, a country which I never worked for previously and I would like to know how should I charge the job? They are a big company in western Canada. They require 1 aerial external, 1 external low shot, 3 interior shots at 5000px wide and another 3 in different color scheme of the same. Plus 3 360 degree QTVR shots. Furniture and interior stuff has to be modeled by yours truly. They supplied CAD files and Revit file of the building. If you want to see my quality, check out my portfolio to have an idea http://petermayer1981.wix.com/portfolio Thanks a bunch!! Cheers Your work is quite good. You are WAY underquoting. I'd quote a minimum of $50/h working time and $25/h bench. I assume you are going for the same quality of work as your portfolio so I'd say each render will be in the $1500-$2000 range. QTVR will be a little extra work even if you shoot from the same POV as your interiors, just to make sure the lighting works and the model is complete 360 degrees, but not as much as setting up the initial scene. They do take an extra piece of software though - so say another $500 each. 2 exterior (aerial + low) - $3000-4000 3 interior - $4500-6000 3 QTVR - $1500 so... $9000 - 11500 is reasonable for that amount of work. I'm sure some people would do it for less and some people would refuse to do it for that. You have to figure out for yourself what is profitable and worth your time. I would be happy with that deal though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 i recently got my forum license Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Hunt Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 from the corner store? How much did it cost? Glad to see you go legit after all these years of using the forum without a license. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcjames Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Interesting thread - to those who are asking how much they should charge for certain jobs; it seems the answers are in the replies that teach you how to work it out for yourselves; not in arbitrary guesswork... "Give a man a fish..." I heard an interview of Maciej Kuciara (www.kuciara.com very successful concept artist) who said that if you are struggling to find clients or clients are not willing to pay market prices for your work; your work is not good enough. That is it. If you want to compete with successful artists - the only answer is lots of hard work, late nights and practice to improve your work or to give up and try something else. This isn't supposed to sound preachy - I have clients but I'm working with the "work not good enough, need to practice" phase too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryannelson Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 I said i'd post an image and a price I did recently, so here you go. I did this for $1500CDN for a friend of mine. There are numerous "discounts" in that price though, but that's subject to my own scrutiny and decisions. I think the 1500-2000 range is reasonable for an image like this though. http://www.cgarchitect.com/2015/03/halifax-office1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 I said i'd post an image and a price I did recently, so here you go. I did this for $1500CDN for a friend of mine. There are numerous "discounts" in that price though, but that's subject to my own scrutiny and decisions. I think the 1500-2000 range is reasonable for an image like this though. http://www.cgarchitect.com/2015/03/halifax-office1 Yes it's well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heni30 Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Let's all show and tell! I did this over the weekend. A redo of attached photoshop collage attempt. US $700. I re-used merchandise from photo collage. Total time to do a bunch of rectangular boxes - about 7 hours. They're not all this sweet. [/ATTACH] It's ironic because the photo IS true photo realism. Supposedly our sacred pursuit on this forum. I love the way the collage guy is using the slanted soffit for his perspective line at top Edited March 6, 2015 by heni30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Jaber Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 ya this is one very good image and i belive the price is range 1500-2000 is good one , dont know if other places people will sell it for more with this high end quality? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Jaber Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 im doing this as a part of 12 images in one space this is only a test , but i believe i was screwed by the price am doing 12 similar image for $5000 ?? i wanted to give the client a good discount from the beginning so we work on future projects but seems i did a wrong assumption ? 415$ per image was a wrong decision i believe, couldn't tell it needed much work from the plans he provided at beginning ? and because its an open space area thought it would be easier for working ? if i would work it again i believe i wouldn't do it for less than $10000,15000 ! i believe its a common thing we all fall in , when u start a project and discover that it needs much time and effort than expected ? so any professional suggestion?? do you believe its suitable to re talk the pricing thing ? already 40 days passed and am still working on it day and nights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Hunt Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 its a tricky thing giving a discount so you "might" get more work in the future, you "might" just not get more work in the future too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic H Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 never give discounts you will never be able to charge properly after you go cheap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryannelson Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 (edited) I discounted mine a bit because it was my first try in 3dsmax with vray. I have to say that I already much prefer and find it to be much more robust and consistent than in Rhino. Asking for more is up to you. I'm sure some people will say that your quote should be the price you invoice, and others might say to invoice for the appropriate price. There's something to be said about being professional and having the ability to quote an accurate price. It's arguably not fair to the client's expectations if your cost far exceeds the quote. That being said, if your quote was based on assumptions and were inaccurate due to lack of information, or wrong information, provided by your client, that's a different story entirely. I'm speaking from other contracting I've done in the past, not specifically arch vis. I've asked for more in the past, and I got it. I guess it depends on your contract and your relationship with your client. In my opinion, a quote is just that: a quote. edit* I discounted my price to my current client because he's one of my best friends and I trust him with my life. Otherwise, I would never discount based on promises of more work... that's too much of a gamble for me, I'd rather just get paid what I deserve. Edited March 5, 2015 by ryannelson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frog_a_lot Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 Never give discount to get work.. only give discounts for loyal/repeating clients.. and then only small amounts. As for Quote vs Invoice.. Id be tempted to say that is wrong and probably illegal to try and invoice for more than the quote.. unless the client has broken your terms and conditions. A quote is just that, it is a quote to say how much the work will cost.. you can't go and say "Actually it was 150% more".. if someone tried to do that to me then i'd tell them to piss off and that I wasn't paying more than the original quote. Think about going into a shop and seeing an item for $1000 and then going to checkout and them saying "This is now $1500 because our rent went up".. wont happen, the price is the price. If the client asks for extra work or changes, then you supply them with another quote saying it will cost how ever much extra. I worry about some of the people of this forum with the way they say they run their business or do their work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy L Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 Discounts are for grocery stores and shoe shops.... What does your contract say about changes etc? If you dont have contract you are asking to be taken advantage of. If you do have a contract then call the client and discuss the best way forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinhoura Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 I honestly don't think discounts are such a bad idea. I give discounts (or even do pro bono work in rare cases) from time to time and it usually turns out great and often lead to new projects (sometimes with the same client, sometime with a new one). The whole business/market is very flexible and you should be able to adapt to that. Yes, we all want to be super rich but you can miss out on great little jobs. The only important thing as far as I am concerned is not if you should give discounts or not but to know what project is worth the discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Hunt Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 In many ways I agree with you, in certain circumstances a discount can work for you, BUT it should not be the norm. I know its more complicated but just take a look at the VFX industry at how loss leading has ruined many studios. As for Quote v Invoice, a while ago I needed some electrical work done, simple stuff like putting in a new power point and a few other odds and ends. We got a quote and a time estimation. The quote we went with was $100/hour plus parts and would take an just under an hour. Great got the job done and made sure that the job was done in the time frame. All good until we got the invoice for $200 plus parts, what the??? what the electrician didn't specify was that it was $100/hour per contractor. He rocked up with his apprentice, who held the ladder and past him a few tools. Just imagine if he rocked up with a whole crew. After a few choice words we paid him the original quote and told him to take a flying leap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 im doing this as a part of 12 images in one space this is only a test , but i believe i was screwed by the price am doing 12 similar image for $5000 ?? i wanted to give the client a good discount from the beginning so we work on future projects but seems i did a wrong assumption ? 415$ per image was a wrong decision i believe, couldn't tell it needed much work from the plans he provided at beginning ? and because its an open space area thought it would be easier for working ? if i would work it again i believe i wouldn't do it for less than $10000,15000 ! i believe its a common thing we all fall in , when u start a project and discover that it needs much time and effort than expected ? so any professional suggestion?? do you believe its suitable to re talk the pricing thing ? already 40 days passed and am still working on it day and nights? 40 days and not done yet? You're going to end up working below minimum wage!!! joke. But I'm curious to know why it's taking so long because judging by the picture the scene seems kinda minimalist. Do you have a lot of custom modelling to do? The idea to offer a discount is reasonnable but only if you don't have to model new stuff for each shot imo. Keep up the good work, your renderings looks great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Jaber Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 40 days and not done yet? You're going to end up working below minimum wage!!! joke. But I'm curious to know why it's taking so long because judging by the picture the scene seems kinda minimalist. Do you have a lot of custom modelling to do? The idea to offer a discount is reasonnable but only if you don't have to model new stuff for each shot imo. Keep up the good work, your renderings looks great! thx man , well yes the shots are so detailed , and the designer am working with is a perfectionist !! too much modeling was required for this project adding to it the trial and change of materials + objects? the thing here is that we are designing while making the 3d , and this too affect the overall timing , i believe that my planing for such project needed more thinking? don't know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Hunt Posted March 6, 2015 Share Posted March 6, 2015 this then falls into the "design development" realm which should be charged at an hourly rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippelamoureux Posted March 7, 2015 Share Posted March 7, 2015 You could provide X number of free changes in your next contract, after that you will charge an extra fee. Because it must be crazy to work with a perfectionnist. Looks like your client didn't even plan his project before...he's hoping you'll do it for/with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frog_a_lot Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 You could provide X number of free changes in your next contract, after that you will charge an extra fee. Because it must be crazy to work with a perfectionnist. Looks like your client didn't even plan his project before...he's hoping you'll do it for/with him. Most places I have worked and usually how i do it is x2 changes per job.. after that changes cost money depending on scale of changes.. I wont charge for simple stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmitriyyemelianenko Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Hello guys, I think that this is the right place for my question. I need to do an animation, interior walkthrough. There would be 4 interior scenes (restaurant, lobby, office, commercial area-cafeterias,stores) don't shure that the last one is really one scene:) I have to do everything , modeling, texturing, rendering plus some design in office scene. The lenth of animation is about 1min. It will be a huge building somewhere in Europe, so this is the promotional project. The clients are not architects directly, they are animation studio so all the compositing part is on their side. But the walkthrough should be at high artistic level, right now we dont have strict deadlines, and it is all information I have at the time, they will provide some more info in few days. I have some experience in animation but didn't make any commercial one. So its pretty hard for me to tell the price. I hope someone could help me with the price point. Here is an example of my stills, so you know at what level my work is https://www.behance.net/gallery/22515469/Cozy-Bedroom Best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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